Support NeoGAF

[Bgamer90]

somehow this smacks me as rather unrealistic.

I'm pretty sure the Holiday 2014 deals on the Xbox One would have sounded unrealistic to you back in early 2014 too (I know it would have been the case for me).

 

[Loris146]

I'm pretty sure the Holiday 2014 deals on the Xbox One would have sounded unrealistic to you back in early 2014 too (I know it would have been the case for me).

They added a new sku anyway. They can't this year. Maybe a revision but i think it's too early.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

I'm strictly speaking of the big movers in the industry, i.e. publishers of 3rd party AAA retail games. There is a lot of inertia in these organizations, and plans have to be long term.

Like I said, it would have taken several years to pivot; and the fact that Wii was standard def and very low power cannot be discounted since getting the core excited has involved spectacle graphics for as long as I can remember.

But the Wii was undeniably more powerful than the PSP, and the PSP had pretty significant support from those exact selfsame AAA third party publishers in a way that the Wii did not. Those AAA third parties were still producing SD 'low power' content at the same time they were producing HD 'high power' content.
They just weren't putting any of it on the Wii, even after the writing as to which console was market leader was clearly on the wall.

It's certainly a popular sentiment, but it seems like wishful thinking to me. How exactly do you gently introduce a bunch of non-gamers who have no interest in playing traditional games to traditional gaming on a console they bought to play motion and fitness games?

Again, this is a hugely reductionist view of the Wii userbase into a binary split of "Nintendo fanboys who buy anything Nintendo" and "Casual soccer moms who would never buy real games anyway".

 

[Delusibeta]

I think there is a very strong argument to be made (and it has been, by multiple people in multiple NPD threads) that abandoning people who came to console gaming via the Wii has led to those people abandoning console gaming completely, so we have a market of consolidated niches targetting solely the highest spenders.

This is great if the only games you enjoy happen to be in those consolidated niches, and you don't mind paying more and more money for less and less content.
If you don't however you might be sat there wondering "what the fuck has happened to this hobby of mine?".

It's also hugely reductive to suggest "all hardcores stayed and bought HD twins" and "all casual left to play candy crush saga". There isn't a binary switch between 'hardcore' and 'casual', there is a huge and varied spectrum. This is why you can see a company like Gameloft getting huge simply by cloning successful 'hardcore' games on mobile - those 'casuals' that left because they weren't getting any interesting games on the Wii are buying exactly the type of games they would have bought on the Wii if anyone had been making them, they're just now doing it in a completely different market.

If you enjoy console gaming, losing vast chunks of population to non-console gaming is not a good thing.

The problem with this argument is that it implies that the people who left console gaming when the Wii died will never give it a second chance, which doesn't gel with the statements about PS4 buyers being new the PlayStation ecosystem from last year.

You also have to remember that we're talking about a $400 console selling about 20 million (worldwide) in a bit over a year, and a (now) $350 console selling another 10 million (worldwide) on top of that in the same time frame. Frankly, that's not the work of the traditional core gamer demographic, I suspect the Wii audience is a surprisingly large chunk of that.

 

[Bgamer90]

They added a new sku anyway. They can't this year. Maybe a revision but i think it's too early.

I would really be surprised if we see a revision this year. Seems too soon for one.

Think it's a given that there will be new SKUs alongside the games coming during the second half of the year. Halo 5 bundle will probably be the only SKU that will be more expensive than whatever the price of the regular Xbox One SKU is at that time.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

But the Wii was undeniably more powerful than the PSP, and the PSP had pretty significant support from those exact selfsame AAA third party publishers in a way that the Wii did not. Those AAA third parties were still producing SD 'low power' content at the same time they were producing HD 'high power' content.
They just weren't putting any of it on the Wii, even after the writing as to which console was market leader was clearly on the wall.

Either they were leaving money on the table, or they'd done the market research and understood that the Wii's audience wasn't interested in those games. I know which one I think is more plausible.

Again, this is a hugely reductionist view of the Wii userbase into a binary split of "Nintendo fanboys who buy anything Nintendo" and "Casual soccer moms who would never buy real games anyway".

Is it actually reductionist? Aside from Nintendo fanboys, non-gamers, and second console owners who would prefer to buy a AAA game on their HD twin 100% of the time, who exactly was buying Wiis, and in what numbers?

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

You also have to remember that we're talking about a $400 console selling about 20 million (worldwide) in a bit over a year, and a (now) $350 console selling another 10 million (worldwide) on top of that in the same time frame. Frankly, that's not the work of the traditional core gamer demographic, I suspect the Wii audience is a surprisingly large chunk of that.

Why not?

 

[Loris146]

I would really be surprised if we see a revision this year. Seems too soon for one.

Think it's a given that there will be new SKUs alongside the games coming during the second half of the year. Halo 5 bundle will probably be the only SKU that will be more expensive than whatever the price of the regular Xbox One SKU is at that time.

Yeah for "new sku" i mean the one without kinect. If they didn't drop kinect they could not cut the price so much the last year. This is what i meant

 

[AniHawk]

Is it actually reductionist? Aside from Nintendo fanboys, non-gamers, and second console owners who would prefer to buy a AAA game on their HD twin 100% of the time, who exactly was buying Wiis, and in what numbers?

families and kids, or at least people who enjoy families and kid-friendly games. skylanders, lego games, and star wars, and platformers all did really well. i am not sure if 'nintendo fanboys' is supposed to be a catch-all for the nintendo games that did well on the system, but it shouldn't be, seeing as nintendo franchises did better than ever before with regards to 2d mario, 3d mario, and mario kart when it came to consoles. twilight princess sold in numbers it hadn't since the n64 era, and donkey kong did better than it had since the first snes game. i think that when that audience was no longer being served, they went over to the 360 mainly, especially with minecraft and continued support from skylanders and lego.

the only first-party company serving this audience right now is nintendo. you regularly see wii u games coming out ahead of ps4 and xb1 counterparts despite the userbase disparity. eventually, one the ps4 and xb1 are affordable and have built up a library, these gamers may migrate to those platforms. but i would assume it would be at reduced numbers, given that we know these games are losing users year over year. this was something the wii successfully targeted from the onset. and has been pretty much botched by every platform manufacturer this gen (on consoles - the 3ds seems to be trying to keep the dream alive, but handheld was always kind of a home for this audience).

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

The problem with this argument is that it implies that the people who left console gaming when the Wii died will never give it a second chance

I think that's a separate argument actually; I don't think people who felt burnt by the lack of being catered to on the Wii would never return to console gaming on any sort of grounds of principle, but I don't see any of the AAA publishers making any effort whatsoever to court them back.

EDIT:

families and kids, or at least people who enjoy families and kid-friendly games.

And I would add 'lapsed' gamers who have at some point in their lives been 'real' gamers but stopped playing and the current dualshock controller is overwhelming to because they were not actively playing games while controllers evolved into what they are today.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

families and kids, or at least people who enjoy families and kid-friendly games. skylanders, lego games, and star wars, and platformers all did really well. i am not sure if 'nintendo fanboys' is supposed to be a catch-all for the nintendo games that did well on the system, but it shouldn't be, seeing as nintendo franchises did better than ever before with regards to 2d mario, 3d mario, and mario kart when it came to consoles. twilight princess sold in numbers it hadn't since the n64 era, and donkey kong did better than it had since the first snes game. i think that when that audience was no longer being served, they went over to the 360 mainly, especially with minecraft and continued support from skylanders and lego.

the only first-party company serving this audience right now is nintendo. you regularly see wii u games coming out ahead of ps4 and xb1 counterparts despite the userbase disparity. eventually, one the ps4 and xb1 are affordable and have built up a library, these gamers may migrate to those platforms. but i would assume it would be at reduced numbers, given that we know these games are losing users year over year. this was something the wii successfully targeted from the onset. and has been pretty much botched by every platform manufacturer this gen (on consoles - the 3ds seems to be trying to keep the dream alive, but handheld was always kind of a home for this audience).

And I would add 'lapsed' gamers who have at some point in their lives been 'real' gamers but stopped playing and the current dualshock controller is overwhelming to because they were not actively playing games while controllers evolved into what they are today.

Good points. The fact that Nintendo managed to sell its traditional games in large numbers to the Wii's audience is particularly striking, and something I hadn't considered. I guess Nintendo was close to the golden formula all along: producing games that could bridge the gap and introduce consumers of novelty shovelware to console-specific experiences. But no one else has ever really been able to duplicate this deftness, and Nintendo just can't do it all on its own.

 

[CosmicQueso]

You also have to remember that we're talking about a $400 console selling about 20 million (worldwide) in a bit over a year, and a (now) $350 console selling another 10 million (worldwide) on top of that in the same time frame. Frankly, that's not the work of the traditional core gamer demographic, I suspect the Wii audience is a surprisingly large chunk of that.

That's an interesting take... And if true makes all the categorization of "core" and "casual" a bit less meaningful. Thanks for the research idea.

I think that's a separate argument actually; I don't think people who felt burnt by the lack of being catered to on the Wii would never return to console gaming on any sort of grounds of principle, but I don't see any of the AAA publishers making any effort whatsoever to court them back.

Save that thought for after E3. There are some interesting mass market targeted titles and franchises coming.

 

[jhmtehgamr20xx]

.

 

[Bgamer90]

You're talking about a $300 price drop in the span of two years. $300. Two years. Price drop.

Actually not since the SKU with kinect (what the system launched with) would more than likely be $100 more -- in this case $300 ($200 drop).

At some point people on the board and customers at large are going to wonder why a healthy video game console (in their eyes, these are still gaming systems. Not commodity hardware like smartphones which you get for practically free w/ a contract on release) has a $300 price drop in simply two years.

I don't think many will care much as long as the system is continuing to get major games/recent multiplats. It would be different if it was at that price with its most recent retail game being something that released 4+ months ago -- the true sign of a "dead console"... a la Dreamcast in early 2002 (haha).

$350 is about as good a price MS can ask for XBO right now. Maybe $299 to match a PS4 price drop, but they aren't going lower than $299 this year, if they even get there. The red ink would flow like a waterfall.

I don't think they'll go lower than $299.99 this year either but I wouldn't say it's impossible for them to do so. Many big games coming to the system late this year and I think they'll try to do anything they can to make the most out of that fact.

 

[ZSaberLink]

I mean, Guitar Hero didn't just explode "late in the cycle," it exploded in 2006, when the PS2 was firmly a budget console aimed at families and non-gamers - the Wii's only competitor in that chunk of the market.

The demographic that accounted for the vast majority of the PS2's sales was just the regular old gamer demographic that we recognize today as accounting for the vast majority of the PS4's sales.

From vgsales (seems reasonable but is this correct?)
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2006 16.22 103.69
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2007 14.20 117.89
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2008 13.70 131.6
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2009 7.90 139.5
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2010 7.30 146.8
Fiscal year ending March 31, 2011 6.40 153.2

50M PS2s were shipped (I presume these are shipped?) after 2006. It's not an insignificant amount mind you. The PS1 had shipped about 88M consoles according to the same site by 2001. So in a fairly similar timeframe, the PS2 shipped about 12M more than the PS1. Hard to say Guitar Hero & its budget price didn't have an impact on the 50M in some way. The PS2 had ridiculous legs and thus was able to sell as much as it did. As such, discounting the time after 2006 for the PS2 is kind of ridiculous when it's a good third of its total sales.

And I would add 'lapsed' gamers who have at some point in their lives been 'real' gamers but stopped playing and the current dualshock controller is overwhelming to because they were not actively playing games while controllers evolved into what they are today.

Anecdotally, a lot of my friends that had the Wii U had a Wii and were Nintendo gamers back in the SNES/N64 days, but the Wii got them back into gaming again. They skipped the GC generation however. I'm not sure how far this extends to the general populace obviously, but I wouldn't be surprised if there are quite a few folks who came back to gaming with the Wii and went to the 360/PS3 and now the PS4/XB1 instead.

 

[Javin98]

Uncharted 4 is still gonna be linear, ND just widened the levels further & added more options in combat.

Yeah, I never said Uncharted 4 was open world, but ND is going for a more open approach, like MGS4 and I can't wait to see how much the gameplay has improved. But my point is it's nice to still have a more linear shooter in a gen of open world games.

I think in one of The Order threads it was mentioned that preorders for the game was very good and people are looking forward to buying the game.
I'm guessing it will be in the top 5 of February's NPD list.

It should. Looking at Amazon's hourly charts, The Order 1886 is currently the best selling game this month, aside from Far Cry 4, which is currently $38

 

[CosmicQueso]

The idea that a game like Bloodborne could outsell a game like The Order in the US NPDz seems highly, hugely unlikely to me.

Some seem convinced that this is possible if not probable.

Personally, I'm really looking forward to a high production value summer blockbuster style popcorn game. Seems like everything now is 30 hour open world with treadmill grind.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

You'd expect it to be top 5, it's a major AAA first-party title.

It will be top 5 and probably higher. Games always climb higher on Amazon the closer they get to release. Being this high a week out is better than most games have performed.

 

[Biker19]

Unless MS responds via a $250 (and possibly a special $199.99 Holiday) SKU.

You think Microsoft's shareholders will go for this? No way will they drop the price of the console to $250, let alone $199 so soon, & not just after 2 years of the console being out on the market.

I don't think many will care much as long as the system is continuing to get major games/recent multiplats. It would be different if it was at that price with its most recent retail game being something that released 4+ months ago -- the true sign of a "dead console"... a la Dreamcast in early 2002 (haha).

But PS4's getting the same amount of multiplat games (& more).

Also, it'll just make consumers think Microsoft's being desperate just by lowering the price of the console to $200 or $250 just because Sony's lowering the price of the console to $300.

 

[IvorB]

Attach rate isn't dependent on smartphone being widespread.

I alone have an attach rate of 4+1 smartphones. Those with an annual upgrade cycle, even more.

Can't find the more recent totals but in 2012

Wow. That's a lot of smartphones.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

The idea that a game like Bloodborne could outsell a game like The Order in the US NPDz seems highly, hugely unlikely to me.

Some seem convinced that this is possible if not probable.

Personally, I'm really looking forward to a high production value summer blockbuster style popcorn game. Seems like everything now is 30 hour open world with treadmill grind.

We already know it won't happen. Both games are looking successful right now though. The Order appeals to the mainstream and Bloodborne appeals to the hardcore.

 

[Lynn616]

You think Microsoft's shareholders will go for this? No way will they drop the price of the console to $199 so soon, & not just after 2 years of the console being out on the market.

I dont see shareholders complaining about the MSFT stock price. Do you? I also dont see the Xbox division losing money.

They are at $349 right now. A $100 drop with a slim would not be unheard of. $249 by Christmas is possible. $199 seems a bit low to me but $249 with a slim doesnt.

 

[michaelius]

But the Wii was undeniably more powerful than the PSP, and the PSP had pretty significant support from those exact selfsame AAA third party publishers in a way that the Wii did not. Those AAA third parties were still producing SD 'low power' content at the same time they were producing HD 'high power' content.
They just weren't putting any of it on the Wii, even after the writing as to which console was market leader was clearly on the wall.

PSP was most powerfull handheld console at that time promising to capture same audiences as stationary consoles - it makes perfect sense that it had third parties support in initial years.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

I dont see shareholders complaining about the MSFT stock price. Do you? I also dont see the Xbox division losing money.

They are at $349 right now. A $100 drop with a slim would not be unheard of. $249 by Christmas is possible. $199 seems a bit low to me but $249 with a slim doesnt.

I don't see either console getting a redesign this Fall. I guess we'll see at E3.

 

[Lynn616]

I don't see either console getting a redesign this Fall. I guess we'll see at E3.

I dont see the PS4 getting one soon because it started so small. The X1 started so big that I can see it getting one before the PS4.

 

[Bgamer90]

You think Microsoft's shareholders will go for this? No way will they drop the price of the console to $250, let alone $199 so soon, & not just after 2 years of the console being out on the market.

Not sure why $250 seems impossible -- especially if the PS4 goes to $300 this year. I think it's pretty obvious that MS wants the Xbox One to stay cheaper.

Pretty sure many will view it as smart if it means getting more people locked into the Xbox Live/Windows 10 ecosystem.

But PS4's getting the same amount of multiplat games (& more).

Okay? Never said otherwise. Don't see why you said that. The same was true during Holiday 2014 when there were many Xbox One deals.

Also, it'll just make consumers think Microsoft's being desperate just by lowering the price of the console to $200 or $250 just because Sony's lowering the price of the console to $300.

I don't get this -- on one hand it seems like we all agree that they need to be cheaper than the PS4 to be competitive but yet on the other, if they do it then "consumers will view them as desperate". Doesn't really make much sense to me.

I think the majority will just see it as "the cheaper gaming box that has some recently released (multiplat) games" and nothing really more than that.

____________________

I don't see either console getting a redesign this Fall. I guess we'll see at E3.

I dont see the PS4 getting one soon because it started so small. The X1 started so big that I can see it getting one before the PS4.

I agree that we'll more than likely see an "XB1 slim" before we'll see a "PS4 slim" due to the sizes of the launch models. Can't see either of them coming out until next year at the earliest though.

 

[EatMyFace]

I dont see the PS4 getting one soon because it started so small. The X1 started so big that I can see it getting one before the PS4.

Those 8 GDDR5 chips can be reduced to only 4 on the PS4. Also a redesign isn't always about making it smaller, its about cutting costs. Theres also that comment Netflix made about added 4K support.

 

[Biker19]

Those 8 GDDR5 chips can be reduced to only 4 on the PS4. Also a redesign isn't always about making it smaller, its about cutting costs. Theres also that comment Netflix made about added 4K support.

I hope that this doesn't affect future games & multiplats by going with 4 GDDR5 chips on the slim PS4.

 

[funkystudent]

People thinking MS wont go to $299 probably would have said they wouldnt go to $350 (and then to $330)

I fully expect the XB1 to be $299 by the holidays or even after E3. Maybe a hardware revision will be needed to get it there but it will happen.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Not sure why $250 seems impossible -- especially if the PS4 goes to $300 this year. I think it's pretty obvious that MS wants the Xbox One to stay cheaper.

Pretty sure many will view it as smart if it means getting more people locked into the Xbox Live/Windows 10 ecosystem.




Okay? Never said otherwise. Don't see why you said that. The same was true during Holiday 2014 when there were many Xbox One deals.



I don't get this -- on one hand it seems like we all agree that they need to be cheaper than the PS4 to be competitive but yet on the other, if they do it then "consumers will view them as desperate". Doesn't really make much sense to me.

I think the majority will just see it as "the cheaper gaming box that has some recently released (multiplat) games" and nothing really more than that.

____________________





I agree that we'll more than likely see an "XB1 slim" before we'll see a "PS4 slim" due to the sizes of the launch models. Can't see either of them coming out until next year at the earliest though.

I think at this point it needs to be more than $50 cheaper. It needs value adds like a free year of Live, gift cards, a bundled high-profile new release, etc. Basically what they did last holiday season in relation to whatever the PS4 costs.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

I hope that this doesn't affect future games & multiplats by going with 4 GDDR5 chips on the slim PS4.

Why would it? It's the same amount.

 

[GamerJM]

Personally, I'm really looking forward to a high production value summer blockbuster style popcorn game. Seems like everything now is 30 hour open world with treadmill grind.

I'm going to go off on a tangent not really related to sales here but I wish the market could accommodate more games that are somewhere in between, I'm honestly not too terribly fond of either type of game. I guess it makes sense because the more linear a game is the more tightly the developer can control the experience in terms of story and gameplay, and those treadmill grind games allow developers to monetize the consumerbase more easily. But I'm sure a lot of people here agree with me in that neither exactly consists of what I really want out of this medium.

 

[1st Course]

Those 8 GDDR5 chips can be reduced to only 4 on the PS4. Also a redesign isn't always about making it smaller, its about cutting costs. Theres also that comment Netflix made about added 4K support.

You mean 8 chips. PS4 uses 16 512MB chips and 2GB (16Gb) GDDR5 chips don't exist.

 

[Nirolak]

The idea that a game like Bloodborne could outsell a game like The Order in the US NPDz seems highly, hugely unlikely to me.

Some seem convinced that this is possible if not probable.

Personally, I'm really looking forward to a high production value summer blockbuster style popcorn game. Seems like everything now is 30 hour open world with treadmill grind.

I could see it more from the angle of The Order faceplanting than Bloodborne having huge, unprecedented success.

 

[Game Guru]

The problem with this argument is that it implies that the people who left console gaming when the Wii died will never give it a second chance, which doesn't gel with the statements about PS4 buyers being new the PlayStation ecosystem from last year.

You also have to remember that we're talking about a $400 console selling about 20 million (worldwide) in a bit over a year, and a (now) $350 console selling another 10 million (worldwide) on top of that in the same time frame. Frankly, that's not the work of the traditional core gamer demographic, I suspect the Wii audience is a surprisingly large chunk of that.

I would like to point out that older children whose first console may have been the Wii would currently be in or approaching the younger end of the demographic that PlayStation and Xbox target. PlayStation and Xbox target 18-35 year old men. 2006 was 8 years ago from 2014, so the 18 year old men buying PS4s and XB1s at launch would have been 10 years old boys back when the Wii launched. Yeah, the soccer moms and grandparents who bought a Wii aren't coming back, but the children and grandchildren of those soccer moms and grandparents are now in the right demographic to buy a PS4 or XB1. What's hurting Nintendo currently is that the soccer moms, grandparents, and children of 2014 are all in on mobile. The effect that mobile may have on PlayStation and Xbox won't be felt until 2022 when the 10 year old boys of 2014 are 18 year old men and thus would be the target demographic for PlayStation and Xbox.

 

[Ty4on]

Those 8 GDDR5 chips can be reduced to only 4 on the PS4. Also a redesign isn't always about making it smaller, its about cutting costs. Theres also that comment Netflix made about added 4K support.

I think 4 is impossible. If I'm not incorrect its 256-bit bus is built up of 8 32-bit busses that need to be used by 8 chips or a multiple of 8.

 

[jhmtehgamr20xx]

.

 

[StevieP]

You'll have to forgive me for disagreeing. I spent as lot of time with Wii fps games, they control like absolute garbage. The movement is putrid. And I tried all the ps3 move fps as well, absolute disaster there also.

Unless your preferred method is KBM, i'm going to respectfully call your dual analog preference inferior in every way except quick turning (which, as mentioned, you have to adjust to your liking with IR).

 

[Welfare]

Where's the Gamecube vs Dreamcast vs Wii U graph?

 

[4Tran]

You also have to remember that we're talking about a $400 console selling about 20 million (worldwide) in a bit over a year, and a (now) $350 console selling another 10 million (worldwide) on top of that in the same time frame. Frankly, that's not the work of the traditional core gamer demographic, I suspect the Wii audience is a surprisingly large chunk of that.

At those price points, you can bet that the vast majority of those buyers are hardcore gamers. The reason why the figure is so high is revealed by the steep dropoff of the PS360 - gamers were tired of their old consoles and were itching to upgrade.

I think that's a separate argument actually; I don't think people who felt burnt by the lack of being catered to on the Wii would never return to console gaming on any sort of grounds of principle, but I don't see any of the AAA publishers making any effort whatsoever to court them back.

Most of those gamers don't fit the needs of the AAA publishers, so it's not a surprise they didn't try too hard to cater to those groups. You can see this in the ineffectiveness of the AAA publishers in the mobile space. These companies are strong in their own niche, but not so much outside of it - so why wouldn't they stick to their core competencies? Personally, I think that the AAA industry can use a bit of shake up, but this isn't a compelling for it.

Unless your preferred method is KBM, i'm going to respectfully call your dual analog preference inferior in every way except quick turning (which, as mentioned, you have to adjust to your liking with IR).

FPS gamers ususally list the precision of controls as:
1. Keyboard & mouse
2. PS Move
3. Dual-analog controller
4. Wiimote
5. Kinect

 

[TsuWave]

I'm pretty sure the Holiday 2014 deals on the Xbox One would have sounded unrealistic to you back in early 2014 too (I know it would have been the case for me).

still. that is just a whole different level. i mean, xbox is still a business.

 

[ILoveBish]

Unless your preferred method is KBM, i'm going to respectfully call your dual analog preference inferior in every way except quick turning (which, as mentioned, you have to adjust to your liking with IR).

And i'll just let you know, that you're of a very small minority with that opinion. I've tried it out extensively, i've also set it up for my buddies who i play cod with, and they all ended with "WTF is this shit". It is a horrid control scheme that is dead for a reason.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Most of those gamers don't fit the needs of the AAA publishers, so it's not a surprise they didn't try too hard to cater to those groups. You can see this in the ineffectiveness of the AAA publishers in the mobile space. These companies are strong in their own niche, but not so much outside of it - so why wouldn't they stick to their core competencies?

Again, this presupposes that unserved customers are a homogenous bunch that only play candy crush saga. There are reams of genres that - if not eradicated completely - have just been left to indies to cater demand for.
Genres that AAA publishers are very familiar with working in, they have just made the decision not to.

At least some of the reason for that - and some of the reason why others do better on mobile than they do - is the sort of lazy contempt for the market into 'with us or against us' demographics; if you don't like $100 million budget Cinematic ShootBang VII, then you must like $150,000 Kawaii Match 3 free to play buy our best deal on gems now

 

[4Tran]

Again, this presupposes that unserved customers are a homogenous bunch that only play candy crush saga. There are reams of genres that - if not eradicated completely - have just been left to indies to cater demand for.
Genres that AAA publishers are very familiar with working in, they have just made the decision not to.

At least some of the reason for that - and some of the reason why others do better on mobile than they do - is the sort of lazy contempt for the market into 'with us or against us' demographics; if you don't like $100 million budget Cinematic ShootBang VII, then you must like $150,000 Kawaii Match 3 free to play buy our best deal on gems now

And you're assuming that AAA developers are in position to make any type of game at will. The reality is that any developer is going to have their specialties, and that's where they're going to devote their efforts. They may have the space to expand beyond that to a degree, which is why games like Skylanders and Just Dance exist, but there's a limit to their flexibility. It's not a matter of contempt - it's one of ability and concentrating on core competencies. As I pointed out before, it may or may not have been a good idea, but it makes business sense.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

And you're assuming that AAA developers are in position to make any type of game at will. The reality is that any developer is going to have their specialties, and that's where they're going to devote their efforts. They may have the space to expand beyond that to a degree, which is why games like Skylanders and Just Dance exist, but there's a limit to their flexibility. It's not a matter of contempt - it's one of ability and concentrating on core competencies. As I pointed out before, it may or may not have been a good idea, but it makes business sense.

So why is something like The Sims - one of the best selling franchises ever and up there with GTA and Call Of Duty in the sales stakes - languishing in shitty microtransaction facebook spam 20 friends a day to earn a happiness point low production value limbo, while the much lower selling Battlefield is almost the entirety of EAs portfolio to the extent that all games from now on will be built using an engine designed for an FPS if there aren't ideological factors at play about what sort of audience 'deserves' high production values?

 

[Dragonborn]

You're talking about a $300 price drop in the span of two years. $300. Two years. Price drop.

At some point people on the board and customers at large are going to wonder why a healthy video game console (in their eyes, these are still gaming systems. Not commodity hardware like smartphones which you get for practically free w/ a contract on release) has a $300 price drop in simply two years. And at some point, a competitor (i.e Sony) should maybe make that a focal point in some of their advertising to deter people from a product that's seeing massive price drops so early in its life-cycle.

$350 is about as good a price MS can ask for XBO right now. Maybe $299 to match a PS4 price drop, but they aren't going lower than $299 this year, if they even get there. The red ink would flow like a waterfall.

If the PS4 goes to 350 or 299, MS will have to move below $299. It's become plenty clear that the X1 cannot sell at the same price, and if MS wants to end up ahead they need to be significantly cheaper.

Price isn't the only issue they face but it's the only one (or rather the easiest) they can fix

 

[4Tran]

So why is something like The Sims - one of the best selling franchises ever and up there with GTA and Call Of Duty in the sales stakes - languishing in shitty microtransaction facebook spam 20 friends a day to earn a happiness point low production value limbo, while the much lower selling Battlefield is almost the entirety of EAs portfolio to the extent that all games from now on will be built using an engine designed for an FPS if there aren't ideological factors at play about what sort of audience 'deserves' high production values?

That's because EA has mismanaged their PC business. John Riccitiello is known for having done a terrible job the last few years of his leadership for a reason you know.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

That's because EA has mismanaged their PC business.

But then we then come back to the realisation that the reason one of the biggest gaming franchises in the world isn't on consoles (when tellingly there was a port to the PS2) the larger publishers seemingly show no interest in catering to demographics outside of sports/shoot/drive anymore.

 

[theprodigy]

so, what game do we think will be #1 in February NPD?

so tempted to take the Majora's Mask pick

 

[Elfstruck]

so, what game do we think will be #1 in February NPD?

so tempted to take the Majora's Mask pick

Well, either Majora or Evolve. But The Order might surprise lots of people