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[theignoramus]

Hopefully this is the first step toward Iran reintegrating with the western world and normalized relations between Iran and the States.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Where do you guys go to digest information on events like these? Do you read multiple news outlets and, if so, which?

I wonder if i should ask this in new thread.

http://www.bbc.com/news

Their top story is currently Greece though.

 

[Bremsstrahlung]

This is great. Between the Cuba thing and this, it's like we're entering a new age of international relations. And it's good for the citizens of those countries, too, of course.

 

[sangreal]

Great, let's hand over billions of dollars to the World's leading sponsor of terrorism. That should work out well.

It's their money. Also, as it relates to terrorism, the U.S. Is not removing Irans designation and they are still subject to those related sanctions (which have nothing to do with this deal)

Looks like congratulations have already been received from Assad, who's ruthless government is propped up entirely by Iran (including a $1billion lifeline just last week)

As you point out, the sanctions were not stopping Iran from supporting Assad's losing battle with ISIS. Also, Syria is allied with some of the parties to this deal. Remember it is not a U.S.-Iran deal.

Meanwhile the Iranian people suffer under the oppressive regime and atheists, gays, journalists et al, wonder how such liberal bastions as the US can throw them under the fucking bus.

What on earth does any of this have to do with sanctions on their nuclear program?

 

[Kadayi]

The Saudi issue will never make sense to me. They never seem to be called into question for their export of Wahhabism. It's sickening.

Indeed. Adam Curtis made a rather fascinating documentary called 'Bitter Lake' which explained the background to these things. Part of the original US/Saudi Oil deal was the promise that the US wouldn't attempt to undermine the conservative Saudi religion. What Roosevelt etc didn't foresee though was that the Saudis would take the oil money and use it to export their particularly intolerant brand of religion throughout the region through setting up schools in neighbouring states as a way to shore up their influence.

Overall I think the Iran deal is good news.No surprise at the salt coming from some quarters though.

 

[MisterFalcon]

Overall I think the Iran deal is good news.No surprise at the salt coming from some quarters though.

Still better then agreeing with Bashar Assad that this deal is a really good thing.

 

[Condom]

This is hilarious. BBC basically catches the Israeli Education Minister with his pants down: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI9fHLXFypg

Lmao

He ends with 'we're also defending the west', sure mate by making people hate us for being allied to you am i rite.

Anyway, Iran is a sleeping giant and it will embarrass the Arab states in performance once the sanctions are all lifted.

 

[Ikael]

How can you say this when its very clear that puppet dictators use WMDs against millions of people, most of the victims being innocent citizens?

Because realpolitik is all about choosing the lesser evil, as disgusting as said lesser evil is. Which is why I welcome this reaproachment with Iran. Because this conflict has always been about choosing the lesser evil in this Iran leaded shiite block VS Saudi leaded sunni block, and at long last this is what the US has done for a chance, rather than siding with the guys with the fattest Washington lobby.

I hate the house of saud as much as the next guy, they teamed up with the founder of the sunni sect that is plaguing the world with violence Including bokoharram all the way in nigeria.

And in Pakistan. And in Chechenya. And in Mali. And in Indonesia. And...

But to deny that the west hasn't caused disastrous bullshit in the arab world just for the sake of defending secularism is very wrong and disgusting. I would rather fight and die for real freedom than to pick the "lesser" evil between the two of those.

When did I ever deny that the west has caused disastrous bullshit in the arab world? Quite the opposite. I am defending that that it is us, the west, the ones that fucked up every single arab regime and politician that ever attempted to secularize the arab world for the shake of pleasing our saudi "friends" (and fighting "communism" too), and that a huge part of the modern proliferation of terrorism, extremism and sectarian violence in the ME is the hubris of these failed western policies, which has backfired us horribly.

 

[Shengar]

Pre-1953 Iranian coup d'état (which was orchestrated by the US and the UK, simply because the Iranian government wanted to take back it's oil, and is what formed the basis for the Shah and later Ayatollah's to take power), Iran was actually very progressive, with a democratically elected and secular government and Prime Minister.

Every time
Evey time the people of middle world trying to set things right by their own, the west stepped in and put some usurper that listen to them on the seat of leadership.
Al-Afghani, Mossadeq, every goddamn time.

And now Iran is murdering and overthrowing democratically elected leaders. Or supporting the most murderous regime in the Middle East with thousands of troops and billions in weapons.

And now WHO do you think that make them doing that?
WHO's the sponsor behind the regime that pushes dangerous ideology that threatened Shiites in the region?

Technically I don't disagree. There is a way to achieve modernization, but before modernization you need to lift people out of poverty and famine. If you're gonna thrust miniskirts, commercialism and booze down the throats of a deeply rural, conservative and poor, agricultural country guess what happens.

No, no you're wrong
The only right way of modernization is the one that resembles the west, you see? Middle worlder don't have the right on their own brand of modernization. They have follow exactly the way of the west.

Spoiler

/s

When did I ever deny that the west has caused disastrous bullshit in the arab world? Quite the opposite. I am defending that that it is us, the west, the ones that fucked up every single arab regime and politician that ever attempted to secularize the arab world for the shake of pleasing us (and fighting "communism" too), and that a huge part of the modern proliferation of terrorism, extremism and sectarian violence in the ME is the hubris of these failed western policies, which has backfired us horribly.

FTFY

 

[Zalusithix]

Still better then agreeing with Bashar Assad that this deal is a really good thing.

If Assad says that gravity is real, are you going to deny that as well? I know this seems difficult to some, but it is, in fact, possible to agree with people on things even if you generally don't see eye to eye with them. Just because you don't like somebody, it doesn't make everything they say wrong.

 

[Azih]

It's like the American leadership took a look at Middle Eastern policy. Realized that they were being used by Saudi Arabia as their pet attack dog in the Saudi proxy war against Iran and realized that that was the dumbest possible position to be in.

Obama: "So... uh... Saudi Arabia right... They're the source of funding for all these.. uhhh.. Wahhabi types right? The uh.... ISIS and 9/11 and uhh.. Taliban and all that"

Foreign Policy Advisor: "Uh, yes, sir. That's right"

Obama: "And Iran.. they're funding... regional terrorist types right... Hezbollah and Assad and those uh... people in Libya.. Hamas... uhh.. folks like those"

Foreign Policy Advisor: "Right again sir."

Obama: "Seems to ME that uhh... the Saudis are causing a heck of lot more problems for the word than uh... the Iranians.. They're funding the people that we're spending billions actually fighting. why.. uhh.. why exactly are we taking their side in this uh... regional uh... struggle?"

Foreign Policy Advisor: "Well sure Saudi actions might be worse but they say they're our friends while Iranians say they're not."

*Obama gives the advisor a look*

Foreign Policy Advisor: "... But Saudi's got oil"

Obama: "Doesn't Iran?"

Foreign Policy Advisor: "..."

 

[Trey]

Obama press conference on the deal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzBlcd4n73g

edit: lol, it's funny to me how Obama gives such long winded responses to media questions that you forget what was even asked.

 

[norinrad]

Obama press conference on the deal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzBlcd4n73g

edit: lol, it's funny to me how Obama gives such long winded responses to media questions that you forget what was even asked.

Heh great deal all around.

 

[Funky Papa]

I find interesting that nearly nobody is talking about how this deal is going to be massively important for Europe, as the lifting of sanctions against Iran's oil and gas will will reduce its dependance on Russia's Gazprom.

Russia Seen as Biggest Oil-Market Loser When Iran Comes Back

Russia, which vies with Saudi Arabia and the U.S. to be the world’s largest oil producer, has the most to lose when Iran returns to the global energy market, according to a dozen analysts and executives at oil companies, banks and trading houses interviewed by Bloomberg.

“Iran is going to be competing in Europe head-on with Russia,” said Ed Morse, head of commodities research at Citigroup Inc.

Iran has been barred from selling oil in Europe since 2012 when the European Union imposed a ban on crude imports. Coupled with tougher U.S. sanctions making it more difficult to buy Iranian oil with dollars, that caused output to drop from 3.6 million barrels a day in 2011 to 2.6 million barrels last year.

Putin is a smart man, but there's a chance this time was paying too much attention to the Ukrainian front and dashboard videos on Liveleak.

 

[Crisco]

Republicans are just a bunch of fucking cowards, that's all there is to it. Comparatively speaking, Iran is a tiny country with a tiny economy and a tiny military. They aren't even at the level of Saddam's Iraq in 1991, which we managed to send back to the stone age in about 2 weeks. They aren't at the level of Israel or even our Arab partners in the region. They pose zero threat to us or our interests, at least directly speaking, which is why there is no "risk" to this deal. We're not conceding anything. We're getting Iran to do exactly what we want without firing a single shot, and giving up nothing in return.

People against this deal speak of Iran as this massive existential threat to the US and/or Israel, but that's simply not true. The only threat they ever posed was destabilizing the region if they built a nuclear weapon. This deal takes that away while maintaining Iran's place as relatively minor developing nation.

 

[Minion101]

Republicans are just a bunch of fucking cowards, that's all there is to it. Comparatively speaking, Iran is a tiny country with a tiny economy and a tiny military. They aren't even at the level of Saddam's Iraq in 1991, which we managed to send back to the stone age in about 2 weeks. They aren't at the level of Israel or even our Arab partners in the region. They pose zero threat to us or our interests, at least directly speaking, which is why there is no "risk" to this deal. We're not conceding anything. We're getting Iran to do exactly what we want without firing a single shot, and giving up nothing in return.

People against this deal speak of Iran as this massive existential threat to the US and/or Israel, but that's simply not true. The only threat they ever posed was destabilizing the region if they built a nuclear weapon. This deal takes that away while maintaining Iran's place as relatively minor developing nation.

For real. Isael is the one with nukes but Iran is the threat?

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

Republicans are just a bunch of fucking cowards, that's all there is to it. Comparatively speaking, Iran is a tiny country with a tiny economy and a tiny military. They aren't even at the level of Saddam's Iraq in 1991, which we managed to send back to the stone age in about 2 weeks. They aren't at the level of Israel or even our Arab partners in the region. They pose zero threat to us or our interests, at least directly speaking, which is why there is no "risk" to this deal. We're not conceding anything. We're getting Iran to do exactly what we want without firing a single shot, and giving up nothing in return.

People against this deal speak of Iran as this massive existential threat to the US and/or Israel, but that's simply not true. The only threat they ever posed was destabilizing the region if they built a nuclear weapon. This deal takes that away while maintaining Iran's place as relatively minor developing nation.

Or the idea that if Iran got a nuke they would just blow up Israel, or give it to a terrorist organization to use it.

 

[RustyNails]

For real. Isael is the one with nukes but Iran is the threat?

Besides, how many times has Iran attacked Israel in the past as compared to Israel attacking Iran? Shit reeks of pre-2003 Iraq war drumbeats being beaten by the same gaggle of idiots in the media as well as the Congress, along with a fresh batch of certified lunatics like Tom Cotton and Cruz. And people say Republicans and Democrats are the same, and it didn't matter who we voted for in 2008 and 2012. Fuck those people with cactuses.

 

[Dai101]

For real. Isael is the one with nukes but Iran is the threat?

Let's not forget that they have an undeclared number of nukes, neither their capacity to build more.

 

[Blue Lou]

http://www.theonion.com/article/us-soothes-upset-netanyahu-shipment-ballistic-miss-50842
http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.666205

 

[thefro]

UN Security Council has approved the nuclear deal with a unanimous 15-0 vote

European Union has also approved the deal today

So we're just waiting on the US Congress (who has 60 days to review it) and Iran's parliament to approve it

 

[RustyNails]

UN Security Council has approved the nuclear deal with a unanimous 15-0 vote

European Union has also approved the deal today

So we're just waiting on the US Congress (who has 60 days to review it) and Iran's parliament to approve it

Of course a senator from a podunk state of Arkansas knows better about the Iran nuclear agreement than Kerry, P5+1 negotiators, UNSC and EU.

 

[Mister0079]

so the only people opposing the deal are republicans and netanyahu. that should tell you all you need to know.

 

[Parch]

Republicans need a foreign enemy to keep the peeps scared. Combine this with their hate on for Obama and of course they're going to oppose this with their bullshit politics and complete lack of logic.

It's not blind trust and there are ways you can keep an eye on things to maintain the agreement with Iran, but for heaven's sake, give peace a chance. The war mongering Republicans are not doing anything to make this easy. They're not helping the US, and they're certainly not helping the world.

 

[Version 3.0]

Of course a senator from a podunk state of Arkansas knows better about the Iran nuclear agreement than Kerry, P5+1 negotiators, UNSC and EU.

Don't leave out the nuclear scientists! You know, the people who actually have the knowledge to say that we will be able to tell if Iran is keeping their end of the agreement.

 

[RustyNails]

Don't leave out the nuclear scientists! You know, the people who actually have the knowledge to say that we will be able to tell if Iran is keeping their end of the agreement.

fuck that noise. All we need is grit, bible and the good 'ol gut feelin to tell us what we need to do in such a difficult circumstance.

 

[benjipwns]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/21/uk-iran-nuclear-kerry-idUKKCN0PV0KG20150721

U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry said a speech by Iranian Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei on Saturday vowing to defy American policies in the region despite a deal with world powers over Tehran's nuclear programme was "very disturbing".

"I don't know how to interpret it at this point in time, except to take it at face value, that that's his policy," he said in the interview with Saudi-owned Al Arabiya television, parts of which the network quoted on Tuesday.

"But I do know that often comments are made publicly and things can evolve that are different. If it is the policy, it's very disturbing, it's very troubling," he added.

Ayatollah Khamenei told supporters on Saturday that U.S. policies in the region were "180 degrees" opposed to Iran's, at a speech in a Tehran mosque punctuated by chants of "Death to America" and "Death to Israel".

"Even after this deal our policy towards the arrogant U.S. will not change," Khamenei said.

 

[benjipwns]

http://www.wsj.com/articles/a-richer-iran-will-target-the-americas-1437342912

In the foreword to the 2014 book “Iran’s Strategic Penetration of Latin America,” former Colombian Defense Minister Marta Lucía Ramírez wrote that Venezuela’s “ ‘axis of unity’ with Iran embodies Latin America’s growing distance” from the U.S. “This is not to distract from the many conflicts the U.S. is engaging in the Middle East or elsewhere,” she noted. But she wanted “to remind our northern neighbors of the kind of disengagement in Latin America that led to a nuclear standoff in 1962.”

Now the Obama administration has agreed to phase out many economic sanctions on Iran in exchange for its promises to disable parts of its nuclear program. The deal provides for winding down international restrictions on trade and investment with Iran. It is also expected to gradually liberate more than $100 billion in Iranian assets frozen by the U.S. and other countries.

This means that even if the agreement prevents Iran from getting a nuclear weapon, it will make the world less safe. National Security Adviser Susan Rice admitted as much last Wednesday when CNN’s Wolf Blitzer asked if “support [for] international terrorism” might be one use for the liberated assets. “In fact,” Ms. Rice said, “we should expect that some portion of that money would go to the Iranian military and could potentially be used for the kinds of bad behavior that we have seen in the region up until now.”

And not only in the Mideast. One likely destination for some of that money will be the Islamic Republic’s military, ideological and terrorist activities in the U.S. backyard. As Joseph Humire, executive director of the Washington-based Center for a Secure Free Society, put it to me last week, “if Iran gets access to the global financial system, they’re going to double down in Latin America.”

...

Propaganda is an Iranian priority. HispanTV, launched in 2011, is a Spanish-language channel run by Iran. It has partnership agreements with state-run television in a number of ALBA countries. In his 2014 book, “Remote Control,” the respected Bolivian journalist Raúl Peñaranda alleged that Iran’s former President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad donated $3 million to President Evo Morales to finance and equip Bolivia’s state-owned television station Abya Yala.

Gen. Douglas Fraser , former head of the United States Southern Command, testified to Congress three years ago that Iran was backing at least 36 Shiite Islamic cultural centers in Central America, the Caribbean and South America. This year Gen. John Kelly, who now runs Southern Command, testified that there are more than 80.

Last October a Hezbollah operative was arrested in Lima on suspicion of plotting terrorism in Peru. Press reports said that police discovered detonators and TNT in his home, and evidence that he may have been scouting out the Jorge Chávez International Airport for a possible attack.

President Obama is boasting that his deal is Reaganesque. But Reagan did not abandon Latin America to enemies of liberty.