Bulletbrain
Member
Solid point. Next quarter should give a better picture with PS5s finally breaking even.
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Sony Q1: 2.3 M PS5s shipped; G&NS reports record-breaking revenues
kingfey
Banned
You wont see pc money that much, because its goes to the sequel spending. With their pc games now, its not even that much money. HZD on steam isnt even 2m. But that money, would go to enhancing the HFW. With GOW costing $200m, they will need different income. PC is perfect example. Unless you want them to bastardize their IP for mobile market. The Witcher mobile is bring money for cdpr. I would prefer them to do pc game, than making it mobile.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
TheGodfather07
Member
is PS5 the fastest selling console in PlayStation history or fastest from every console?
btw they confirmed that's not being sold at a loss anymore
Kdad
Member
This, is the real game.Sales remain unchanged from the April forecast due to higher-than-expected sales in the Electronics Products & Solutions (“EP&S”) and Music segments, substantially offset by lower-than-expected sales in the Imaging & Sensing Solutions and Pictures segments.
Operating income is expected to be higher than the April forecast due to expected increases in operating income in the Music, EP&S and Pictures segments, as well as an expected decrease in operating loss in All Other, Corporate and elimination.
Income before income taxes is expected to be 955 billion yen, which is higher than the April forecast. This expected increase is primarily due to the above-mentioned expected increase in operating income.
Net income attributable to Sony Group Corporation’s stockholders is expected to be higher than the April forecast mainly due to the above-mentioned expected increase in income before income taxes
hoping for a 10% upside to the stock prices
yurinka
Member
They are growing, but slowly compared to the huge mobile market growth:
8 bit gen, 74M: NES (61.91), MS (~13)
16 bit gen, 87M: SNES (49.10), MD (32), PCE (5.8)
32/64 bit gen, 148M: PS1 (102.49), Nintendo 64 (32.93), Saturn (9.26), 3DO (3)
PS2 gen, 210M+: PS2 (155), Xbox (24+), Game Cube (21.75), Dreamcast (9.13)
HD gen, 273M: Wii (101.63) PS3 (87.4), Xbox 360 (84)
Previous gen (still active), 265M+: PS4 (116.4+), XBO (50+?), WiiU (13.56) + Switch (84.59), retro mini consoles (??)
Current gen (just starting): PS5 (10.1), Series (5-6?), Steam Deck (--), Switch 2 (--)
It depends where do you include WiiU and Switch, because they aren't timed like the other ones and since Wii Nintendo decided to make their own thing instead of focusing on high end hardware. And also depends on if you don't consider that the previous gen still will continue selling during some years (make sure Switch+PS4 combined will send over 20M units more in the future).
Reasons that I'd say prevented consoles to grow faster:
-Gaming market is moving to F2P/GaaS, which grows way faster than paid games. Mobile and PC adopted F2P way faster, consoles and platform holders started to adopt it recently
-Consoles adopted way later aggresive discounts and pricing from PC for paid games, so many players moved to pc
-Mobile eating the portable market and growing way faster than the console market, these players lost interest on traditional IPs and business model
-Sony making huge mistakes with PS3 launch, Nintendo with WiiU, MS/Sega/others not being able to win any generation
-Consoles are focused on gaming, mobile and PC instead have other key uses so people see it as more ok to make a big hardware spending there. It's easier to justify
-Some countries having console specific regulations or taxes that makes pretty difficult/too expensive/a pain in the ass/impossible to sell or buy consoles there
Regarding to the future, I think consoles will continue their trend of growing while also merging with both PC and mobile: the hardware is becoming the same for all 3 markets, and the games too. In the very long time, even more due to streaming but always there will be a market for local gaming due to huge portions of the world not being able to get a decent internet connection and having even very poor 4G coverage.
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ethomaz
Banned
That is actually 10.1m.2. Units shipped
Q1 FY 2021
LTD
PS5 10.0M
Thirty7ven
Banned
Fastest console, only behind handheld GBA.
recursive
Member
Q1 FY2021 Highlights
PS5 is the fastest-selling console in history
"Since launching in November 2020, PS5 global sales have outpaced PS4, SIE’s previous record holder for fastest selling console"
1. Units sold
PS5 reached 10M sold-through (as of July 18, 2021)
PS4 reached 10M sold-through (as of August 10, 2014)
2. Units shipped
Q1 FY 2021
LTD
3. PlayStation Network
4. Sony Games
Sony Interactive Entertainment (PlayStation)
Spider-Man: Miles Morales (PS4/PS5) from Insomniac Games has sold more than 6.5 million copies
MLB The Show 21 (Multi-platform) from San Diego Studio has sold more than 2 million copies
Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart (PS5) from Insomniac Games has sold more than 1.1 million copies
Returnal (PS5) from Housemarque, has sold more than 560,000 copies
Sony Music Entertainment Japan's Aniplex (Mobile Gaming)
Fate/Grand Order from Sony’s Aniplex surpassed $4 billion in lifetime player spending according to Sensor Tower (Jan 30, 2020)
FGO fever is still going strong in Japan according to Sensor Tower
5. SIE's internal development studios grew from 20 to 500 people
“Many of our studios grew naturally. These studios were small before, and gradually grew from about 20 to 500 people”
6. Sony Q1 FY2021 Consolidated Results
7. G&NS Q1 FY2021 Results
8. Sony posts record gaming revenue (GNS + Music Mobile Gaming)
- June 2021 ¥633,770 = (615,810 + 17,960)
-June 2020 ¥632,130 = (606,109 + 25,920)
June 2021
June 2020
9. G&NS FY2021 Forecast
Sales and Operating Income remain unchanged from April forecast
10.Pre-Pandemic Levels
Q1 FY19 ( Software + Services) = ¥324,917
Q1 FY21 (Software + Services) = ¥448,020
11. PS5 sales target
FY21 14.8M+
FY22 22.6M+
12. PS5 market share target
CY25 50%+ (approx. $45Bn in revenue)
13. PlayStation (SIE) revenue structure
Software, Services&Peripherals account for 80% in FY20
14. PSN growth since FY13
Approx. 10X
15. Free To Play accounts for 25%+ of total PS Store consumer spend
16. PlayStation expanding beyond console
17. Sony's ability to generate cash
18. Sony's capital allocation (from FY21 through the FY ending March 31, 2024)
Why no vita data??LTD
Interfectum
Member
Great summary but, unless I missed it, there seems to be one important bulletpoint that people don't like to talk about...
Most console games target a very specific audience (young male, most of the time white). No matter how accessible or cheap you make console gaming, GamGam will never opt to play Bloodborne over Angry Birds. The last major attempt to get the mainstream audience to even look at console gaming was the Wii and you saw the amount of compromises Nintendo had to make to even get people to look at them (simplified consoles, easily digestible games, etc). Even Nintendo couldn't keep that mainstream gamer interested outside of Wii Sports because their DNA is still entrenched in Mario, Zelda, etc which is outside most of the mainstream or non-gamer comfort zones.
At a certain point the industry is just going to have to accept that the types of games hardcore gamers love to play have hit a soft ceiling. The rest of the world has already satiated their gaming appetites through mobile, web or PC.
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ethomaz
Banned
More than…Hi, ethomaz.
According to SIE, 10.0M
4.5m + 3.3m + 2.3m = 10.1m
The pic you posted shows 10.1m shipped.
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Mr Moose
Member
4.5 + 3.3 + 2.3 is 10.1.Hi, ethomaz.
According to SIE, 10.0M
Evilms
Banned
More thanHi, ethomaz.
According to SIE, 10.0M
Marcus Aurelius
Banned
Great analysis!
Mr Moose
Member
Poor Vita
Thirty7ven
Banned
You know it hurts if you got people fighting over 100k units.
PS4 was selling at a loss during its first year tho
Remember they planned to launch it with the camera bundled in for 500$ similarly to Xbone, obviously until that shocking reveal during E3 2013
ethomaz
Banned
It sold at loss until May 2014... after that it was sold at profit.
Around 6 months being sold at loss... but of course that was if somebody buy only the console... for example if it was sold to that PS4 a game or a PS+ sub it become profit.
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Tschumi
Member
I'm just patiently waiting to one day have a chance to ask the xbox fanboys who thought sony's silence last year was 'shit marketing' if they would like their words eaten with a side of custard or gravy
---
legit, u gotta be impressed by how they've managed this during a pandemic and a chip shortage
kyliethicc
Member
The fiscal report lists consoles as "Sold In" meaning shipped to wholesale retailers, not customers.
By end of June 2021, they had sold in 10.1 million PS5s.
The other page that says "more than 10 million" refers to "Sold Through" aka sold to customers.
It took them until July 2021 to hit 10.0 million sold through.
Its 2 different numbers measuring basically the total shipped & total sold.
Like PS4 end of June 2014 was 10.2 shipped, sold 10 mil in August 2014.
PS5 end of June 2021 was 10.1 shipped, sold 10 mil in July 2021.
yurinka
Member
There was a casual web browser/games websites market that later expanded and moved to mobile. That grew the female and old people userbase. Most of these players aren't interested on stuff like Bloodborne but got interested on stuff like Singstar and Eyetoy, and later on Wii and DS casual stuff, plus console games like Just Dance, Animal Crossing and maybe some random casual game more like Nintendo ones etc. and maybe some of them also getting some cool indie games or even moving to hardcore and complex stuff.
So the female player increased their market console thanks to that, even if a big chunk of that casual crowd don't want to buy an expensive game device and prefer to play for free on a device their already own for another purpose like a phone or their PC. I saw numbers showing that on Nintendo or PS achieving over 40-45% of female players.
Many of these young players you mention from generations ago also became older. Over generations the average age of he player has been becoming older for that reason, and also because since many years ago kids prefer to play mobile games, or to play Roblox, Fortnite, LoL or Minecraft on PC over Nintendo/Nintendoish console games.
There's room to grow the console userbase:
-Decreasing console hardware pricing and in the future eventually remove it by moving to platform agnostic services that would be available on consoles, tvs, phones, tablets and PCs
-Continue on the trend of -in addition to traditional games- making more very successful F2P games on console
-Once they address the hardare pricing and have a stronger with F2P and achieve proper crossplay with other consoles and PC, approach some big and difficult markets for console as they are China, Russia, India or South America
-Manage to bring back older gamers from previous generations who became older and left gaming with appealing games (retro-styled games, big libraries of pretty old generations, remakes, bringing back very old classic IPs, avoid too time consuming games, avoid controls that require too strict timing, avoid tiny subtitles, etc).
-Manage to make games more appealing to kids (F2P, user generated content, colorful, emerging gameplay, appealing for the streamers they follow, etc)
Yep, shipped is different than sold to customers.
Regarding their 10M PS5 consoles, they exactly mentioned more than 10M sold to customers as of July 18. And more than 10.1M shipped as of the end of June. Basically meaning that their shipped consoles get sold to customers in a couple of weeks or so. But in any case, Sony ships consoles because they sold them to retailers, so for them consoles shipped already are consoles sold (but to retailers, not to customers).
10.1 = 'more than 10'
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I think that's actually the cause. They beat their estimates. They were never going to beat last year because they had Ghost of Tsushima, TLOU 2 and FF7 all release in/close to that quarter. PS+ numbers are up, game sales yoy are down. They are likely to be up again next year.
Kagey K
Banned
13. PlayStation (SIE) revenue structure
Software, Services&Peripherals account for 80% in FY20
16. PlayStation expanding beyond console
It looks to me like they are going to increase focus outside the hardware, not double down on it.
IAmAnAgnostic
Member
Still no update whatsoever since 6/2020 for the best selling, most respected, best received title of all time. (if you listen to the TLOU2 Stans)
In reality this indicates that the game did far below expectations, which anyone paying attention would already know.
In reality this indicates that the game did far below expectations, which anyone paying attention would already know.
kingfey
Banned
Xbox and Playstation lack the last point. They honestly need games that are targeted to kids. At least xbox has 1 unlucky exclusive kids game, which is roblox, and they own minecraft. Still not enough for kids to enjoy the console.
They need to heavily invest in indie games, and kids games. These are future console players.
Bojanglez
The Amiga Brotherhood
It's easier to grow from a lower base.
MasterCornholio
Member
I don't mean to sound like an asshole but is that a sign of decreasing demand?
So far I haven't seen supply be greater than it but maybe I'm wrong.
ethomaz
Banned
We don't have Xbox data.
at the moment overall, the switch has the best first 12 months, it has to sell 4 million or so more by the end of october, then at the end of november it will in almost all certainty become the fastest selling console again (switch 13th month is march vs ps5s November)
also ps4s down 75% from last year, unless something big changes ps4 will struggle to hit 120 million
yurinka
Member
MS also has Fortnite or Rocket League, which are more played on PlayStation, like pretty likely Minecraft too. I don't know demographics of games like CoD, FIA or GTAV, but I bet there's a huge amount of kids playing them too.
Roblox as of now has Xbox console exclusive, pretty likely timed since its CEO said in the previous quarter's investors call that 'Switch, PlayStation, Quest – all of these platforms make perfect sense for Roblox'.
Regarding Sony, was successful with kids with LBP but wasn't a massive success, and I think there's potential with Astrobot, or even with Dreams if they make it F2P and release a PC port.
These X|S numbers are fake, MS doesn't show console sales numbers. So we don't know them.
As of now PS5 is the fastest selling console ever including Switch after its first 3 quarters, and at the end of its 6th quarter PS5 will continue being the fastest selling console ever.
With the numbers published today:
Sony mentioned today that they secured the chips needed to achive their FY of consoles sold for this quarter (ABOVE 14.8 million for this FY, so MORE THAN 22.6 million since launch). If nothing weird happens, PS5 will be on more than 22.6M while Switch was 19.67M after their first 6 quarters.
Pretty close numbers, so since they did release on opposite parts of the year and knowing that consoles sell way more on their holidays quarter, depending of which part of the year and depending on how do you count it (by FY, by quarter, by month) Switch will be sometimes during a quarter or two temporally ahead of PS5.
Once they solve the lack of chips issue allowing Sony to highly scale up their production, the difference between PS5 and Switch will skyrocket because even if selling at record levels, PS5 are getting sold out in minutes. A couple of days ago here in Spain one of the major retailers got a new shipment and they got sold out in less than 3 minutes.
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mejin
Member
Especially when you are burning huge money to grow. It is not difficult to understand why MS only reveals revenues.
Anyway, percentage without context is utter asinine. People know it, but playing dumb is fun for some.
Bryank75
Banned
Console enables software sales...without the console, the brand and most of the income is dead in the water.13. PlayStation (SIE) revenue structure
Software, Services&Peripherals account for 80% in FY20
16. PlayStation expanding beyond console
It looks to me like they are going to increase focus outside the hardware, not double down on it.
That is a fact.
The graph is only proof of MTX exploding and subscriptions for online too.
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Kagey K
Banned
There were 2 graphs in that post, the 2nd one is more relevant.
Kagey K
Banned
Different companies have different year ends, they don’t run on calendar year.
yeah that's what I said, that includes the ps5s second holiday season,MS also has Fortnite or Rocket League, which are more played on PlayStation, like pretty likely Minecraft too. I don't know demographics of games like CoD, FIA or GTAV, but I bet there's a huge amount of kids playing them too.
Roblox as of now has Xbox console exclusive, pretty likely timed since its CEO said in the previous quarter's investors call that 'Switch, PlayStation, Quest – all of these platforms make perfect sense for Roblox'.
Regarding Sony, was successful with kids with LBP but wasn't a massive success, and I think there's potential with Astrobot, or even with Dreams if they make it F2P and release a PC port.
These X|S numbers are fake, MS doesn't show console sales numbers. So we don't know them.
As of now PS5 is the fastest selling console ever including Switch after its first 3 quarters, and at the end of its 6th quarter PS5 will continue being the fastest selling console ever.
As of today:
Sony mentioned today that they secured the chips needed to achive their FY of consoles sold for this quarter (ABOVE 14.8 million for this FY, so MORE THAN 22.6 million since launch). If nothing weird happens, like covid extra issues blocking the manufacture, be on more than 22.6M while Switch was 19.67M at that point.
Pretty close numbers, so since they did release on opposite parts of the year and knowing that consoles sell way more on their holidays quarter, depending of which part of the year and depending on how do you count it (by FY, by quarter, by month) Switch will be sometimes temporally ahead of PS5.
but you mean the ps5 will be temporarily ahead of the switch when it has an extra holiday season over the switch.
TheGodfather07
Member
its insane that PS5 is the fastest selling console of all time. sony literally keep breaking records. everyone knew it would be a success but who thought it would be the fastest selling console ever? with no signs of slowing down sony are even predicting they will break more of their own records with more than 22m sold in a single year.
if PS4 ends up at 120m, im thinking PS5 will end up somewhere around 130m-135m lifetime. PS4 lifetime sales are even more impressive when you consider it only ever had one price cut, unlike the PS2 which went as low as $99.
if PS4 ends up at 120m, im thinking PS5 will end up somewhere around 130m-135m lifetime. PS4 lifetime sales are even more impressive when you consider it only ever had one price cut, unlike the PS2 which went as low as $99.
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