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[SolidQ]

RDNA4 and much better improved RT if it still can't perform better than the 7900XTX.

We don't have tests yet, and AMD officialy said RT in RDNA4 significant faster

 

[Loxus]

We don't have tests yet, and AMD officialy said RT in RDNA4 significant faster

Yes, but can the PS5 Pro beat the 7900XTX in the same games tested is my question.

 

[SolidQ]

Yes, but can the PS5 Pro beat the 7900XTX in the same games tested is my question.

just wait PS5pro release

 

[cinnamonandgravy]

spending $1500 on a gpu to get a similar performance of $700 ENTIRE console

huh

the pro dont blow but you sniffin too much snow

 

[Loxus]

just wait PS5pro release

Are you implying the PS5 Pro can beat the 7900XTX?

I was busy the last few weeks and haven't been following this stuff lately.

I never would of image the PS5 Pro can beat the 7900XTX in any game.

Now that's bang for buck.

 

[PicoLordens]

That Alan Wake number must be false. Im getting between 80 and 120 fps with these settings on a 4090 and Ryzen 7950X3D

 

[Katatonic]

 

[Bojji]

Yes, but can the PS5 Pro beat the 7900XTX in the same games tested is my question.

It can't. Maybe in some pure RT tech demo but games are hybrid of raster and RT.

7900XTX is almost 2x the power of Pro GPU in raster, even if Pro is 50% better in RT than 7700XT it still won't matter in the end.

 

[Self_Destructive]

This video exists to moderate expectations, not to show the capabilities of PS5 pro, it is to demonstrate how demanding raytracing is.

That's why I said the thread is flawed and not the video.......

 

[SolidQ]

I never would of image the PS5 Pro can beat the 7900XTX in any game.

we're talking about RT, not Raster

 

[Gaiff]

we're talking about RT, not Raster

Follow what Loxus is asking you. Posters said that the RDNA4 RT cores which the Pro has are faster than RDNA3 RT cores. Loxus is asking if the PS5 Pro can beat the 7900 XTX in the games tested in the OP as they're all games featuring ray tracing.

I don't see the Pro coming anywhere near the 7900 XTX, even in games featuring loads of ray tracing, but then again, PlayStation's RT API is far more efficient and AMD's performance in games like Wukong and previously Cyberpunk is broken.

 

[SolidQ]

Loxus is asking if the PS5 Pro can beat the 7900 XTX in the games tested in the OP as they're all games featuring ray tracing.

November 7 soon, then we gonna see comparisions. Anyway N48 way faster than XTX in RT

 

[Tqaulity]

Who was expecting the Pro to match high-end GPUs?

You haven't been paying attention to this forum the last few weeks? How about some of the same folks in this thread saying how the the thread is wrong because the PRO uses RDNA 4 which is superior to RDNA 3...implying that it's superior to 7900 XTX (despite the 7900XTX having over 50% more CUs )

 

[Gaiff]

November 7 soon, then we gonna see comparisions. Anyway N48 way faster than XTX in RT

I doubt the RT cores are so much faster that they can make up for the 60%+ advantage of the 7900 XTX in rasterization.

Look at F1 24, a game where devs bothered putting in work on the Pro. 4K FSR Quality Ultra with all RT effects and 80fps+ on the 7900 XTX. The Pro for comparison doesn't have shadows and needs DRS between 1080p-1440p to remain above 60 using PSSR to upscale to 4K.



The difference between the Pro's GPU and the 7900 XTX is simply too damn big to be covered by anything. The Pro moves up to the mid-range. The 7900 XTX is still high-end, so they're not the same class at all. No real point in comparing them.

 

[kevboard]

aaaaand I gotta stop right away during their Gotham Knights test. that game is known to he an absolute CPU hog when raytracing is enabled.
meaning the performance drop being so steep on the 4090 is almost certainly a CPU bottleneck, and has nothing to do with the GPU.

they should absolutely know this as this game has notoriously bad CPU optimisation.

 

[Senua]

Did I hit a nerv here? So you are spending $1500 on a gpu to get a similar performance of $700 ENTIRE console and you laugh at me for seeing the value of Pro here? Ok

No? My 3080 is still doing me fine thanks

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

This new PC vs PS5 Pro war is more cringe than the last one.

 

[yogaflame]

This new PC vs PS5 Pro war is more cringe than the last one.

Well it use to be PS versus Xbox.

 

[lh032]

This new PC vs PS5 Pro war is more cringe than the last one.

PCMR: lol console war, we prefer platform wars instead!

 

[Corporal.Hicks]

yeah current RT performance pretty much sucks hard regardless of hardware
it sucks so bad, most of the time RT is just for some shadows and reflections... so basically fancier SSAO and screen space reflections (im oversimplifying but cmon its pretty much that).

shame because RTGI and bounce lighting and all that is super sexy.
we need 100x better RT performance.

RT performance isnt nearly as bad as you think. My RTX4080S is not the fastest GPU available, but I can still play RT games at perfectly smooth fps and I really cant complain about performance except for some unoptimized games with stuttering problems (games like SW Jedi Surivor, or a Plague Take Requiem runs at over 120fps on my PC even with RT, but stuttering forced me to play without RT).

Right now I'm playing cyberpunk with ultra RT at 150-170fps (1440p DLSS quality + FG) and have an amazing experience. I think the only people who arnt happy with RT performance are:
- playing at 4K native and refusing to use DLSS / FG.
- owners of older GPUs, or AMD GPUs

Not even the RTX4090 has the power to run every single RT game at 4K native 60fps, although the majority of RT games can still run at over 60fps on this card even at native 4K. I know that, because even my RTX4080S has more than 60fps at 4K in many RT games. For example the "Resident Evil 3 remake" in particular runs extremely well, I get 120-170fps at 4K native.


My raster vs RT performance screenshots in the spoiler:

Spoiler: RT performance cyberpunk

1440p native, raster - 127fps

1440p DLSS Quality (DLSS 3.7.2 looks like native TAA), raster 176fps

1440p DLSS Quality + FG - 244fps

1440p native + Ultra RT - 67fps

1440p native + RT reflections and shadows - 88fps

1440p DLSSQuality + Ultra RT - 110fps

1440p DLSSQuality + FG + Ultra RT - 172fps

4K DLSS balance + Ultra RT -72fps

4K DLSS balance + FG - 106fps

I need to use extremely demanding PT to really destroy performance on my PC at native 1440p, and still thanks to DLSS even PT is perfectly playable.

1440p native + PT - 37fps

1440p DLSS Quality + PT - 68fps

1440p DLSS Quality + PT - 120fps

RT is also very scalable. You dont need to use max RT settings

1440p DLSS Quality + FG, raster - 278fps

1440p DLSS Quality + FG, RT shadows and reflections - 220fps

278fps vs 220fps is just 26% relative difference and the graphics still looks way better. Even screen space reflections can sometimes tank more fps while providing significantly worse quality (in the witcher 3 for example SSR at high settings cut performance in half on my old GTX1080, I had 60-70fps with SSR at low settings and 30fps at SSR high).

Raster

RT reflections + shadows

 

[SolidQ]

Look at F1 24, a game where devs bothered putting in work on the Pro. 4K native Ultra with all RT effects and 80fps+ on the 7900 XTX. The Pro for comparison doesn't have shadows and needs DRS between 1080p-1440p to remain above 60 using PSSR to upscale to 4K.

We talking about heavy RT. Light RT 7900XTX ofc way faster and core clock also higher.

 

[Gaiff]

We talking about heavy RT. Light RT 7900XTX ofc way faster and core clock also higher.

The 4090's performance drops by 41%. I would say that's definitely not "light RT". Besides, I doubt the Pro dabbles much in heavy RT effects. It might be faster than the 7900 XTX in ray tracing, but what's the point if the 7900 XTX drops from 50 to 25 fps (50% drop) and the Pro drops from 30 to 20 fps (33% drop)? They're both unplayable anyway.

 

[SABRE220]

It can't. Maybe in some pure RT tech demo but games are hybrid of raster and RT.

7900XTX is almost 2x the power of Pro GPU in raster, even if Pro is 50% better in RT than 7700XT it still won't matter in the end.

Depends on the rt benchmark as the rt workload becomes more comprehensive the gap lessens and in pathtracing benchmarks like cyberpunk the pro might beat it as in overdrive mode even a 4070 trounces a 7900xtx.

 

[Corporal.Hicks]

We talking about heavy RT. Light RT 7900XTX ofc way faster and core clock also higher.

RTX 40 series have OMM and other ray tracing performance saving features. If game is build to use them (like Black Myth Wukong) no optimization can help the 7900XTX to close the gap.

 

[ap_puff]

I don't think "Look how shitty the games run on our maxed out hardware, you guys are toast!" is the gotcha the PCMRs think it is. PT won't even be supported in most games until consoles can run it well. It doesn't even matter if the PS5 Pro can't handle heavy raytracing. The industry is headed towards GAAS games that look like rainbow vomit that barely use advanced lighting.

 

[Gaiff]

I don't think "Look how shitty the games run on our maxed out hardware, you guys are toast!" is the gotcha the PCMRs think it is. PT won't even be supported in most games until consoles can run it well. It doesn't even matter if the PS5 Pro can't handle heavy raytracing. The industry is headed towards GAAS games that look like rainbow vomit that barely use advanced lighting.

Doubt it. Consoles aren't all that great at running RT, yet it's in most AAA games. PT doesn't run well on anything, not even a 4090. PT will see wider adoption once hardware capable of running it properly emerges.

This isn’t the early 2000s anymore. PC’s market share has expanded exponentially and if a little RTX 6060 can run PT decently, you’ll see it a lot more, regardless of how well consoles run it.

 

[Corporal.Hicks]

My Take:

RT continues to be such a minor thing I never see it as a visual enhancement when actually playing games. If I stop and stare at a particular bit of lighting and switch between the different modes (in games that don't require a restart), I can kinda tell a little bit of a difference...but not really.

That's a little difference according to you?

 

[ChiefDada]

According to MLiD, NXGamer has the PS5 Pro and he is really impressed with RT performance. Says it beats 4070 and is better than any RDNA 3 card. And for the NX haters who claim he is biased, NX is on record questioning if/why PS5 Pro was necessary earlier on.

 

[Gaiff]

According to MLiD, NXGamer has the PS5 Pro and he is really impressed with RT performance. Says it beats 4070 and is better than any RDNA 3 card. And for the NX haters who claim he is biased, NX is on record questioning if/why PS5 Pro was necessary earlier on.

He’s putting words in NxGamer’s mouth. He says that NxGamer said publicly that it was 4070S performance, but that’s not true. NxGamer did a video a few days ago where he tried to ballpark the Pro’s estimate and he said 7800 XT/4070S. He didn’t test it but used available footage and worked with that.

Either way, I really doubt it based on what we know about Alan Wake and F1 2024.

 

[ChiefDada]

He’s putting words in NxGamer’s mouth. He says that NxGamer said publicly that it was 4070S performance, but that’s not true. NxGamer did a video a few days ago where he tried to ballpark the Pro’s estimate and he said 7800 XT/4070S. He didn’t test it but used available footage and worked with that.

Either way, I really doubt it based on what we know about Alan Wake and F1 2024.

I don't think so. I think they've had their behind the scenes conversations but MLiD offered up NXG's recent video (which didn't go as far with the disclosures) as cover/excuse to reveal those off the record comments.

 

[Crayon]

My Take:

RT continues to be such a minor thing I never see it as a visual enhancement when actually playing games. If I stop and stare at a particular bit of lighting and switch between the different modes (in games that don't require a restart), I can kinda tell a little bit of a difference...but not really. It's certainly not worth the insane frame rate hit I get in the process. I've been looking at this stuff since the 2000 series launched and they've made very little progress on it, so RT is basically just a blank spot on the Options menu in my mind.

That said, DLSS/DLAA are fantastic. Adding the RT cores to Nvidia cards was worth the extra cost to me once we got DLSS 3. I'm happy to keep paying them for their expensive cards if I keep getting the level of polish it delivers. I assume PSSR will be similar on PS5 Pro.

Same. I'm a graphics whore but rt has been mostly bogus so far. I am fascinated by even some of the light implementations, and there's of course that one game from 4 years ago that looks great with rt and better all the time. But when it's time to play a game, much less buy a gpu, it's mostly not worth turning on. I'm surprised the hype has stayed for 6 years.

 

[Gaiff]

I don't think so. I think they've had their behind the scenes conversations but MLiD offered up NXG's recent video (which didn't go as far with the disclosures) as cover/excuse to reveal those off the record comments.

Well, he is. Whether that's a cover or not remains to be seen. The numbers really don't add up as far as we know at least. Unless the devs left a lot of power on tap that we can witness in the unlocked modes. We've seen Alan Wake 2 and the 4070S more than doubles the PS5's performance at similar settings. I don't recall the exact resolution numbers for the Pro, but they're far from double.

I could see the Pro reaching 4070S numbers in games like GOWR or TLOU Part II though. Could be what NxGamer tested.

 

[Calico345]

Here is my worthless console pleb and ignoramus opinion that no one asked for.

In the PC space, I can totally understand how this stuff matters. The hardware is technically sufficient to handle it and expand in those areas. Good job on presenting all of that information.

In the console space, I really wish that the Ray Tracing conversation would go away. Consoles are designed for convenience at cost. They still lack in terms of memory and performance, areas that are far more critical to console gaming than graphics. Diminishing returns is real and old. Console games look amazing as is. For $500 consoles, games should be running buttery smooth in their current graphical capacity, suboptimal game developers aside. I don't need better shadows, smoke, and reflections. Those things do not advance games in the areas that games need advancing. Game genres that can benefit from RT are limited to mostly walking simulators and puzzle games like Talos Principle. Yes, I love a graphically beautiful game as much as the next person. I will stop and take in the environment, look in mirrors and puddles, examine textures and details, etc., in action games and adventure games and shooters and racers, etc.. But when games like Arkham Knight existed a decade ago and now we get crap like Gotham Knights, publishers and developers are clearly focused on the wrong things.

The PS5 Pro shows that higher costs on consoles that still fail to deliver higher levels of meaningful performance are the boundary between console and PC and that distinction in hardware capability doesn't need to change. I know, I know, "premium products" and all of that marketing nonsense. But I doubt that the console hardware market is driven by whales; the average consumer is the base install for home consoles. Clean up the performance and fidelity of what we have on consoles now because those areas still clearly need work. Leave the RT and other ultra stuff to PC where it makes sense. In the future, if technology meets cost and RT on console is available for affordable and reasonable prices, cool. We are not there yet. That innovation will happen when it needs to or can organically. I just wish people in the casual crowd would understand all of that so the companies wouldn't focus on the pretty shinies that mean nothing of relevance in games beyond the rare instances where the graphical prowess available enhance the game due to its genre. /ignorant and uninformed opinion and rant

 

[dano1]

Cerny secret sauce in 8 days

 

[Magic Carpet]

I'm just thinking that PS5 Pro will make developers use RT as default. Reflections will be Raytraced or nothing.
If that happens any PC card that can't eek out performance with RT on will be left staring at muddy water.

 

[Mobilemofo]

I must be the only one who doesn't give a fuck about ray tracing. The cost is too much.

 

[bad guy]

I'm just thinking that PS5 Pro will make developers use RT as default. Reflections will be Raytraced or nothing.
If that happens any PC card that can't eek out performance with RT on will be left staring at muddy water.

So all PS5 (non pro) users will also be left behind? Doubt it, only ~15%? of PS dudes will buy a pro. Let's not give 80% of the PS players reflections.

 

[vkbest]

I doubt the RT cores are so much faster that they can make up for the 60%+ advantage of the 7900 XTX in rasterization.

Look at F1 24, a game where devs bothered putting in work on the Pro. 4K FSR Quality Ultra with all RT effects and 80fps+ on the 7900 XTX. The Pro for comparison doesn't have shadows and needs DRS between 1080p-1440p to remain above 60 using PSSR to upscale to 4K.



The difference between the Pro's GPU and the 7900 XTX is simply too damn big to be covered by anything. The Pro moves up to the mid-range. The 7900 XTX is still high-end, so they're not the same class at all. No real point in comparing them.

So where is the video from 7900 XTX running this in Monaco with extreme rain? That is basically DF covered in PS5 Pro, the worst case scenario.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Did I hit a nerv here? So you are spending $1500 on a gpu to get a similar performance of $700 ENTIRE console and you laugh at me for seeing the value of Pro here? Ok

 

[Senua]

Cerny secret sauce in 8 days

 

[DenchDeckard]

Value prospect of Pro is just amazing

Genuinely, you Sony guys are a little scary at how devoted to the church of Sony you are.

 

[bad guy]

And remember that the PS5 PRO still uses AMD hardware (which is inferior in RT to NV) so the most fair comparison would in fact be against other AMD GPUs on the PC

Lol what?

 

[Vroadstar]

Genuinely, you Sony guys are a little scary at how devoted to the church of Sony you are.

Meanwhile, the former green rat jumped a sinking ship and now parades around as the master race expert. Yikes!

 

[kazuyamishima]

Meanwhile, the former green rat jumped a sinking ship and now parades around as the PC Mid Range Race expert. Yikes!

There, fixed for you.

 

[Giallo Corsa]

Genuinely, you Sony guys are a little scary at how devoted to the church of Sony you are.

Denchy, sorry to be that guy but :
If there were any fake neutrality® awards in here you'd probably win the 1st prize mate.
You always try to play it neutral in one post only for you to post combative, contradicting shite in the next one, it gets predictable - not to mention tiring - after a while.

Most of the times, it comes off as incredibly bipolar at best or having a split personality at worst, it's so very transparent which side you've always leant on so please spare us the sanctimonious BS since I don't think that you could fool anyone anymore.

Sorry if I'm sounding like an asshole but you gotta stop doing this since it's been reaching gaslighting levels for a while now.

You're a good dude, just don't be like that

Cheers

 

[Vroadstar]

by the smallest amount while consoles have seen a bigger drop that they may recover from. This could very well be a trend we are seeing here for years to come.

Look at the declines in console sales this year. Seems like its almost 50 percent down for playstation vs last year worldwide. Could be the start of the decline of console gaming.

Well it looks like the majority of Xbox users are.migrating to pc which will only speed up the decline for console as more people are introduced to pc gaming and start spreading word of mouth. Helping friends make decisions etc. It's going to be an interesting few years.

kazuyamishima Giallo Corsa fake neutral guy's former brand is dying, if not dead already and suddenly other consoles are dying too because YAY, I'm a PC mid-range owner now! You can't make this shit up

 

[nemiroff]

I must be the only one who doesn't give a fuck about ray tracing. The cost is too much.

Historically this has more or less been said about most new steps forward in rendering techniques, including used-to-be costly lighting calculations in rasterization (well, actually still is).

Luckily some of us have (or always had) the option to choose, when the developers gave us the option (like it should be).

kazuyamishima Giallo Corsa fake neutral guy's former brand is dying, if not dead already and suddenly other consoles are dying too because YAY, I'm a PC mid-range owner now! You can't make this shit up

I don't know the context of this conversation, but things change so-to-speak.. In an age where exclusivity matters less than it has in a long long time, I don't see much logic per se in the gaming hardware formats to keep on going exactly like they have been, forever. And this may very well also include the PC gaming platform as we know it. ..In the long run.

 

[DenchDeckard]

kazuyamishima Giallo Corsa fake neutral guy's former brand is dying, if not dead already and suddenly other consoles are dying too because YAY, I'm a PC mid-range owner now! You can't make this shit up

Mid range power owner! haha, do you think i'm some kind of pleb?

Ive had beastly PCs way before Xbox even announced the xbox one.

I can list you all my components over the years if you'd like to be proven incredibly wrong. I like Xbox because of play anywhere.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Meanwhile, the former green rat jumped a sinking ship and now parades around as the master race expert. Yikes!

Ive been on PC for years bro. I just lean Xbox in consoles.

Denchy, sorry to be that guy but :
If there were any fake neutrality® awards in here you'd probably win the 1st prize mate.
You always try to play it neutral in one post only for you to post combative, contradicting shite in the next one, it gets predictable - not to mention tiring - after a while.

Most of the times, it comes off as incredibly bipolar at best or having a split personality at worst, it's so very transparent which side you've always leant on so please spare us the sanctimonious BS since I don't think that you could fool anyone anymore.

Sorry if I'm sounding like an asshole but you gotta stop doing this since it's been reaching gaslighting levels for a while now.

You're a good dude, just don't be like that

Cheers

Thanks for this post. I get the message

I've always said I lean xbox when it comes to consoles, but Ive always had playstations and beastly PCs and Nintendo consoles and VItas and PSVR, basically everything I want to purchase I buy. I just like countering some of the equally insane stuff I see on here from Sony bros and winding them up. I am factually more neutral than them who wont even entertain, and actively down play PCs or positive news / points of Xbox etc.

But all in all, I appreciate your response and I'll just try to bite my tongue in the future. Sometimes I'll just have to aggravate the nest so to speak because I dont agree with some of the extreme stuff I'm reading.

For you, and everyone on here who is a decent user. I am always trying to improve my posting. Sometimes it will edge over, but hey at least I am trying

 

[TheRedRiders]

RT performance isnt nearly as bad as you think. My RTX4080S is not the fastest GPU available, but I can still play RT games at perfectly smooth fps and I really cant complain about performance except for some unoptimized games with stuttering problems (games like SW Jedi Surivor, or a Plague Take Requiem runs at over 120fps on my PC even with RT, but stuttering forced me to play without RT).

It's literally the second fastest GPU available on the market in terms of RT performance and even raster lol