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[Bojji]

its just math.

Some think that Pro is powered by Cerny dreams.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Explain how he's wrong instead of posting useless gifs ....are you saying that the 860p base res of Alan Wake 2 is enough to give this game a 4k like image quality at 60 fps? Because it's not. Have you seen how soft and shimmery it still looks? If it was 1080p as a base, then we might have actually gotten a great version of Alan Wake 2 on console ...sadly, we're never going to now nor is it looking like we'll get a high end experience for a few others ...if Sony had given us just a little bit better GPU, we could've had this ....how are you not disappointed with the way Alan Wake 2 is turning out on Pro? You're buying one you should be

 

[demigod]

This fits him perfectly. So much for DenchDeckard buying a PS5 Pro now that he knows Sony didn't moneyhat Wukong exclusivity.

You know what's more of a ripoff? Nvidia cards, but we all still buy it.

 

[Ashamam]

Troll with what? Information?

What the fuck are you smoking?

Nah I'm with Soulzbourne on this one. You love baiting. How many threads about Nvidia cards have someone in there saying nah "insert console here" is better value at every opportunity?

 

[kazuyamishima]

Someone can explain to me something, some people are claiming that the Pro patch for Alan Wake II hasn't released (and it will in a couple of days) and that's why there are no significant differences.

Is this true??

 

[TGO]

So I watch that YouTube Channel that's banned here
So he had the usual Bloodborne comparison and that's probably the first time I could actually see what it was doing.
Still don't think Bloodborne was the best to test it on.
I'm curious what Assassin's Creed Unity & Mirror's Edge Catalyst looks like.

 

[ChiefDada]

Some think that Pro is powered by Cerny dreams.

The other two genuinely don't know any better, but you do so....

 

[Desprado123]

Yep. Thats why i kept harping on the supposed 45% gpu performance upgrade. And now we know its 45% peak and as low as 30%. Thats simply not enough to boost some of these 720p ps5 performance modes to 1080p. you need 100% more GPU power. not 30-45%.

I was a big believer in the PS4 pro. The 2.3x increase in tflops combined with a 1.25x increase in IPC gains meant that we could get up to 2.5-2.8x more performance out of the GPU. The fact that there is no IPC gains this time around and a mere 45% increase despite the 65% increase in tflops was simply never going to enough.

Hopefully, the RT IPC gains will help in future games but even then the vram and cpu bottlenecks will hold back 60 fps rt performance.

100% on point. I think the main target for sony was to launch PSSR not PS5 Pro.

 

[SlimySnake]

Explain how he's wrong instead of posting useless gifs ....are you saying that the 860p base res of Alan Wake 2 is enough to give this game a 4k like image quality at 60 fps? Because it's not. Have you seen how soft and shimmery it still looks? If it was 1080p as a base, then we might have actually gotten a great version of Alan Wake 2 on console ...sadly, we're never going to now nor is it looking like we'll get a high end experience for a few others ...if Sony had given us just a little bit better GPU, we could've had this ....how are you not disappointed with the way Alan Wake 2 is turning out on Pro? You're buying one you should be

He had an issue with my math on 720p vs 900p taking 45% more power. whats funny is that the difference in pixels is actually 56% so it would take 56% more gpu power to go from 720p to 900p. the fact that we are seeing 864p which sits somewhere in the middle means they cant even go from 720p to 900p.

Dragon Age also runs at 864p on the pro. though they do add rtao which has a minimal hit on pc so they probably thought why not.

that figure keeps coming up and it just screams lack of raw gpu power to me. the 30% upgrade in rasterization is far worse than sonys own conservative 45% estimates. that means that gpu is performing half as good as it should. its an xsx caliber fuck up by the engineering team at sony. paying for all that silicon only to use half of the power available.

 

[Gaiff]

Someone can explain to me something, some people are claiming that the Pro patch for Alan Wake II hasn't released (and it will in a couple of days) and that's why there are no significant differences.

Is this true??

There could be another patch, but the Pro patch has been available since the 22nd. The Pro version’s IQ is clearly higher, suggesting PSSR, and there are RT reflections.

He had an issue with my math on 720p vs 900p taking 45% more power. whats funny is that the difference in pixels is actually 56% so it would take 56% more gpu power to go from 720p to 900p. the fact that we are seeing 864p which sits somewhere in the middle means they cant even go from 720p to 900p.

Dragon Age also runs at 864p on the pro. though they do add rtao which has a minimal hit on pc so they probably thought why not.

that figure keeps coming up and it just screams lack of raw gpu power to me. the 30% upgrade in rasterization is far worse than sonys own conservative 45% estimates. that means that gpu is performing half as good as it should. its an xsx caliber fuck up by the engineering team at sony. paying for all that silicon only to use half of the power available.

I still don’t know why you equate pixel count to GPU performance 1:1.

 

[RedC]

The amount of Trolling in these Pro threads, is really distracting.. starting to take the fun out of things.. Just my .02

Then start bringing the fun into things, by trolling back in these Pro threads, to make it really engaging. Just my .50 cents

 

[FrankWza]

Some think that Pro is powered by Cerny dreams.

You guys need to holster your soldering irons. I know there at least 2 dozen members here who are smarter and more capable of engineering a console than him but can you give the guy a break? He's trying his best to get the Playstation brand off the ground and hopes to have a foothold in the console and gaming industry one day. He might surprise us and make a console that can compete with the big boys.

 

[ChiefDada]

Explain how he's wrong instead of posting useless gifs ....

I will only address your first sentence as you sadly spent the remainder of your post rampaging over phantom statements that I never said.

Game Dev - Alan Wake 2 on PlayStation 5 Pro – Behind The Scenes

https://www.remedygames.com/article/alan-wake-2-on-playstation-5-pro---behind-the-scenes Alan Wake 2 is taking full advantage of Sony’s PlayStation 5 Pro to enhance the game experience further. Remedy’s Northlight engine team has spent a good amount of time updating the technology behind Alan...

www.neogaf.com

Increasing the internal rendering resolution consumes a lot of processing power, no matter how powerful your hardware is. However, in our experiments, even putting all the added power to increased rendering resolution provided a barely noticeable difference in the output image or its quality. Adding more pixels to gain visual quality is not straightforward with the new AI-based upscaling methods.

When it comes to Alan Wake 2, it seemed a better idea to improve the signal that we feed into the denoising network rather than trying just to add more data. This led us to improve the rendering quality settings of the Pro Performance mode which is closer to what the base PlayStation 5 version’s Quality mode uses.

Next time, do your own homework, kiddo.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Buster Wolf?

?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

that figure keeps coming up and it just screams lack of raw gpu power to me. the 30% upgrade in rasterization is far worse than sonys own conservative 45% estimates. that means that gpu is performing half as good as it should. its an xsx caliber fuck up by the engineering team at sony. paying for all that silicon only to use half of the power available.

You're using this 30% increase on the basis of games that have ZERO patch to take advantage of the PS5 Pro. There are likely limitations to getting close to 45% on this basis alone.

It's completely disingenuous to use worst case examples as what will be "typical" of ACTUAL PS5 Pro enhanced games going forward. And many of the Pro Patches we do have, like Alan Wake II, appear to be not well optimized or tested. Just a basic patch with many issues and haven't really been thought out particularly well.

The Sony first party games show reasonably well what the Pro is capable of, and should be expected of, on an "average" basis for games that don't even take full advantage of the Pro either because many of these patches were also quickly done and the games never released originally with PS5 Pro in mind. We will not start seeing what top tier examples SHOULD look like until stuff like Death Stranding 2 or GoY where developers have had significant time to create a Pro version.

 

[Three]

Explain how he's wrong instead of posting useless gifs ....are you saying that the 860p base res of Alan Wake 2 is enough to give this game a 4k like image quality at 60 fps? Because it's not. Have you seen how soft and shimmery it still looks? If it was 1080p as a base, then we might have actually gotten a great version of Alan Wake 2 on console ...sadly, we're never going to now nor is it looking like we'll get a high end experience for a few others ...if Sony had given us just a little bit better GPU, we could've had this ....how are you not disappointed with the way Alan Wake 2 is turning out on Pro? You're buying one you should be

I little bit better GPU would have meant a higher price than you have now, for a midgen. People would have just been first in line to complain about that instead. There is no arbitrary cut off where >1080 base res to 4k looks "great" and anything lower looks "shit" for Alan wake or any other game. I don't understand why people are hung up on that nonsense. It's a gradient in quality like anything else. Alan wake 2 still looks great on console.

 

[Loboxxx]

To be fair, so far there's no substantial improvement with the PS5 Pro, except in a few cases. It bothers me specifically that games running around 40/50fps can't reach a stable 60fps, which would be expected.

I'm waiting for mine, but my expectations have dropped a lot

 

[Heisenberg007]

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

To be fair, so far there's no substantial improvement with the PS5 Pro, except in a few cases. It bothers me specifically that games running around 40/50fps can't reach a stable 60fps, which would be expected.

I'm waiting for mine, but my expectations have dropped a lot

There's a pretty substantial improvement universally in the Sony first party or 2nd party type games (HFW, DS, GT7, TLOU1/2, SM1/2, Stellar Blade, FF7R)

Getting twice the frames with even better image clarity than the 30 fps modes is significant.

Games that are 40/50fps and not reaching stable 60 fps are NOT PRO MODES! People need to keep this in mind.

 

[Heisenberg007]

To be fair, so far there's no substantial improvement with the PS5 Pro, except in a few cases. It bothers me specifically that games running around 40/50fps can't reach a stable 60fps, which would be expected.

I'm waiting for mine, but my expectations have dropped a lot

I think you're referring to games that aren't PS5 Pro Enhanced?

Because games that are PS5 Pro Enhanced are showing significant improvements. Some of them even running PS5 30 FPS quality modes at 60 FPS, making it a pretty much 100% improvement - entirely removing the conundrum to choose between Fidelity and Performance modes.

It's unfair to expect unsupported, unpatched games to show those 100% improvements that patched games are showing.

 

[Three]

It bothers me specifically that games running around 40/50fps can't reach a stable 60fps, which would be expected.

A game dropping to 40fps on base would require a 50% increase to hit 60fps. That wasn't happening in any situation, if the performance mode was dropping that bad on base there is no way without a PSSR patch. The Quality Mode on these non-patched games do run better on Pro than even the Performance mode on base XSX/PS5 though which is a pretty good boost to performance.

 

[PandaOk]

It took base PS4 1080p (2.1 million pixels) games and ran them at 4kcb (4.1 million pixels + reconstruction cost on the GPU). Several games ran at 1620p. Some games like GOW and SOTC ran at 1080p 60 fps so doubling the performance.

Talk about rose tinted glasses. God of War was MASSIVELY unstable in its 60fps mode, It couldn’t even consistently hit 60FPS during traversal and dropped into the 40s during even the basic combat encounters. The 30FPS mode dropped more frames than base PS4 mode.



Not doubling performance.

 

[SmokSmog]

sonys own conservative 45%

That wasn't on average, that was "Up to*" ( best case scenario).

 

[tommib]

I thought you need to go above 48 fps to hit the VRR range. Fidelity mode is locked at 30fps, no?

It’s unlocked.

 

[Loboxxx]

There's a pretty substantial improvement universally in the Sony first party or 2nd party type games (HFW, DS, GT7, TLOU1/2, SM1/2, Stellar Blade, FF7R)

Getting twice the frames with even better image clarity than the 30 fps modes is significant.

Games that are 40/50fps and not reaching stable 60 fps are NOT PRO MODES! People need to keep this in mind.

It's clear that this has just come out and there are games that do deliver on the promise of "60fps quality mode" but patched games like Dragon Dogma 2 (I imagine Monster Hunter will suffer the same) or Alan Wake fall short in fps and IQ.

We'll have to wait and see if there's room for improvement in terms of drivers and developer expertise. It's a very expensive product and we're halfway through a generation, so doubts about its performance shouldn't exist in my opinion.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It's clear that this has just come out and there are games that do deliver on the promise of "60fps quality mode" but patched games like Dragon Dogma 2 (I imagine Monster Hunter will suffer the same) or Alan Wake fall short in fps and IQ.

We'll have to wait and see if there's room for improvement in terms of drivers and developer expertise. It's a very expensive product and we're halfway through a generation, so doubts about its performance shouldn't exist in my opinion.

There are no doubts really. It's always going to be up to the developer a bit.

DD2 even if you don't do a Pro mode increases the FPS significantly. Alan Wake isn't as strong, but likely due to a rushed patch.

 

[Senua]

using bg3 alone as an example is not enough, i mean there is a huge improvement on dragon dogma 2 frame rate. Monster hunter wild, another cpu intensive games, also run alot better on the PRO.
its game to game basis.

And why do i keep seeing you bashing the pro, i thought you are not interest in these "wars"?
Does the PRO really bother you that much?

I'm not bashing shit bro, don't be fragile!

 

[pasterpl]

Explain how he's wrong instead of posting useless gifs ....are you saying that the 860p base res of Alan Wake 2 is enough to give this game a 4k like image quality at 60 fps? Because it's not. Have you seen how soft and shimmery it still looks? If it was 1080p as a base, then we might have actually gotten a great version of Alan Wake 2 on console ...sadly, we're never going to now nor is it looking like we'll get a high end experience for a few others ...if Sony had given us just a little bit better GPU, we could've had this ....how are you not disappointed with the way Alan Wake 2 is turning out on Pro? You're buying one you should be

Is the vey low base res the main reason for some of “blurriness” I can see on some PS5Pro games screen grabs?

 

[Jibran#one]

This feels so ridiculously underwhelming and dissapointing and that too with such a high price.
Good for people that want the latest tech and money is not an issue but this ain't for me.

 

[pasterpl]

It funny how people are excited to play old games at slightly better perfoamce. You know you could do that before just by switching to proper gaming PC and with mods etc you can get these old games to run better than pro. /s

 

[pasterpl]

This feels so ridiculously underwhelming and dissapointing and that too with such a high price.
Good for people that want the latest tech and money is not an issue but this ain't for me.

It is not even latest tech, it is old custom laptop CPU, mid range GPU and Sony attempt do make their own DLSS. I miss times when consoles were fully custom piece of hardware.

 

[kazuyamishima]

There could be another patch, but the Pro patch has been available since the 22nd. The Pro version’s IQ is clearly higher, suggesting PSSR, and there are RT reflections.

Oh, good to know. I hope it gets better then

 

[Inviusx]

I've had the Pro for about 8 hours now. I'm slightly underwhelmed by the experience so far aside from a really great improvement with DD2. I am the literal target market for this device and its probably 6/10 so far. The UI feels choppy which by far is the biggest sin for me, considering its a premium "performance" product.

That being said, I didn't really buy this for the games of today, more for the games coming.

 

[Seomel]

To be fair, so far there's no substantial improvement with the PS5 Pro, except in a few cases. It bothers me specifically that games running around 40/50fps can't reach a stable 60fps, which would be expected.

I'm waiting for mine, but my expectations have dropped a lot

which games are those? they mentioned handful cpu bound ones and famous example elden ring, which are unpatched, yet they are in vrr range almost all the time so you will still have excellent experience. This is not ps4 to ps5 leak where you could max out all games to super stable 60

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

PS6 will undoubtedly not include a disc drive. It will only be an accessory

$699 PS6 would also not surprise me

Depends on how the $699 without a Disk drive Pro experiment fares...

 

[Bojji]

I've had the Pro for about 8 hours now. I'm slightly underwhelmed by the experience so far aside from a really great improvement with DD2. I am the literal target market for this device and its probably 6/10 so far. The UI feels choppy which by far is the biggest sin for me, considering its a premium "performance" product.

That being said, I didn't really buy this for the games of today, more for the games coming.

Console UI? Worse than regular PS5 or the same?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I've had the Pro for about 8 hours now. I'm slightly underwhelmed by the experience so far aside from a really great improvement with DD2. I am the literal target market for this device and its probably 6/10 so far. The UI feels choppy which by far is the biggest sin for me, considering its a premium "performance" product.

That being said, I didn't really buy this for the games of today, more for the games coming.

Wait what? Choppy ui?

The base ps5 ui is not choppy. Is it slowing down or something due to transferring or downloading a ton?

If im downloading games the internet speed drops for everything else occasionally….maybe that’s it?

 

[cormack12]

Someone can explain to me something, some people are claiming that the Pro patch for Alan Wake II hasn't released (and it will in a couple of days) and that's why there are no significant differences.

Is this true??

PS5 Pro support was added in the Oct 23rd patch

Update 1.200.002 (Patch 1.2.2)

• PS5 Pro Support: Added enhanced support for PlayStation 5 Pro.

There may be other patches coming of course.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Some think that Pro is powered by Cerny dreams.

Some have nothing better to do

 

[SABRE220]

Ive been quite critical of the pros hardware since the beginning but lets wait for actual patched games when making performance comparisons....making statements like 20percent weaker than a 6800 because of unpatched games isn't exactly smart.

 

[Jibran#one]

It is not even latest tech, it is old custom laptop CPU, mid range GPU and Sony attempt do make their own DLSS. I miss times when consoles were fully custom piece of hardware.

I mean they boast about raytracing and shit but the first game elden ring that has someone open settings even for next gen now
It crumbles with raytracing and quality mode.
I know elden might not be optimized but I was thinking it would just power through it but nope 40 FPS with ray tracing and quality mode without ray tracing is all over the place too
With this colossal price upgrade they should've atleast upgraded the CPU so the already huge amount of CPU bound games would've seen some benefits

 

[Venom Snake]

It funny how people are excited to play old games at slightly better perfoamce. You know you could do that before just by switching to proper gaming PC and with mods etc you can get these old games to run better than pro. /s

I think people here know better how to spend their own money.

 

[Jibran#one]

1 more thing that I don't understand why 2tb?
If I'm a power user or I need more storage I'll upgrade it my self to 4 tb.
Why not keep the 1tb space and put that money towards a better cpu.
Very strange decisions they have made with this console

 

[Radical_3d]

It is not even latest tech, it is old custom laptop CPU, mid range GPU and Sony attempt do make their own DLSS. I miss times when consoles were fully custom piece of hardware.

Cell was the last of it. Kutaragi was always right and Newell was always wrong.

 

[Zathalus]

PSSR is not magic, it runs into the same issues that DLSS and XeSS does, upscaling from below ~1080p will not fool anyone into thinking its a native 4k image. It will look decent enough, but the lower the resolution the more that upscaling and ML artifacts become noticeable and likely. That being said, with the increase in power of the Pro and the massive performance improvements that Unreal engine has seen with newer releases, hopefully games under 1080p native will be far fewer in number.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Do you know what. If GAF held a Christmas troll of the year award - you'd win it by a country mile.

So bottom line based on what I saw in the video, this is exactly what I thought it was. Worth $700? I ask myself if I would upgrade my PC's GPU for the same power upgrade but the inclusion of DLSS that I didn't have as an option before? Yeah....absolutely. So now I'm going to do something similar with consoles except that $700 replaces the entire unit and not just the GPU. Perfectly reasonable upgrade to me.

But I can only speak for myself. I'll let DenchDeckard get back to telling the rest of you what you should do.

The amount of Trolling in these Pro threads, is really distracting.. starting to take the fun out of things.. Just my .02

I think it's pretty sad that pushing back and genuinely feeling that this is a mediocre upgrade for 830 pounds in the UK is trolling.

Let me explain how I see it. I get that there are clearly people who struggle with PCs. I don't understand it myself but I read their comments. It must be true I guess.

I look at the ps4 pro and series x and they were 350 to 450 pounds and you saw a nice jump.

When you get to double that price I think it warrants a very good experience and a clear upgrade of components that need it. Cpu would be nice bit that HDMI bandwidth chip is an absolute necessity. How is a pro console running 4.2.2 croma.

Now I think about my old pc what my son has now. An i7 8700k which is a 7 year old cpu.

That pc has lasted him two generations and 2 x gpus.

For me the console is not worth it, that is not trolling.

Everyone here has bought a ps5 day one and is now upgrading so that's like what 1300 pounds. Could just buy a dope 9800x3d pc today and it would last you two generations easy. You just update your gpu.

Each to their own though. I'm just sharing my opinion. I think this console should be cheaper if it's at this spec and not hitting 60fps etc. Or it should be what it costs and be better, like having a better hdmi chip.

 

[Loboxxx]

which games are those? they mentioned handful cpu bound ones and famous example elden ring, which are unpatched, yet they are in vrr range almost all the time so you will still have excellent experience. This is not ps4 to ps5 leak where you could max out all games to super stable 60

Let's see, I'm the first one who has defended the console, but to see that the Elden Ring fails to maintain 60fps in performance mode, with or without a patch, for me is a failure of this console.

My PC has a 4060 and I run the Elden Ring at 60fps with no problems at 1440p and it's not supposed to be superior on paper to this PS5pro. Something is wrong.

 

[Gryllis]

Just got my Pro.

Rich really went hard on his white box inside a thin cardboard sleeve joke, and then it wasn't even true. It was a single fairly sturdy box - but he didn't even find out since that confused him so much, he just tore it open.

 

[Markio128]

Let's see, I'm the first one who has defended the console, but to see that the Elden Ring fails to maintain 60fps in performance mode, with or without a patch, for me is a failure of this console.

My PC has a 4060 and I run the Elden Ring at 60fps with no problems at 1440p and it's not supposed to be superior on paper to this PS5pro. Something is wrong.

It could be a simple case of the Pro trying to improve both the uncapped fps and resolution at once with some games. I think DF alluded to this in the video.

 

[Madserb2023]

The PS5 Pro is performing as expected. It has the same CPU running at roughly the same speed. It's like the PS4 Pro but worse
That had more than double the GPU power and the same CPU. Game like God of War 2016 went from 30 to about 45 on the PRO at the time with more than double the GPU performance and it's about 45% this time. A 5 to 7 fps gain is about right. If it wasn't for PSSR, it would be a negligible upgrade. I still want one but I will wait to see how PSSR is implemented going forward as that the only benefit.