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Am I wrong in the opinion that Monolith's Middle-Earth games aren't very good adaptations of Tolkien's work?

Drizzlehell

Banned
When I look back at this series, there isn't much that stands out in my mind besides the nemesis system. It's the only standout feature, and the combat system was just copied from the Batman Arkham games, so I don't think Monolith deserves credit for that.

Still, the nemesis system is a great selling point, and it's the only reason these games are worth playing in my opinion. It's such an awesome idea that's executed almost perfectly. I love games that play around with the idea of emergent gameplay, and Monolith fully leaned into that design philosophy. Each playthrough can be a vastly different, personal experience that makes for great stories to pass around with your friends.

Now, you might say, "But Drizzle, those are great video game adaptations of Tolkien's work too!"

Well...I'm not so sure about that.

I'm not a die-hard Middle-Earth fan, but I've read the books and watched The Lord of The Rings trilogy of movies about 75 billion times. They're cinematic masterpieces, and I love these stories for their rich world-building and fun characters that you can root for. Unfortunately, almost none of that can be found in any of those Mordor games.

Pretty much everything about those games that doesn't involve combat or random Uruk encounters is forgettable and dull. The story is forgettable, the level design is flat and uninspired, and the quests and side activities are generic. It's just a bunch of cookie-cutter open-world fluff that would make for a 6/10 game - at best - if it wasn't for those other 2 elements that make the whole thing stand out from other open-world games. This is ridiculous considering the richness of the world-building in Middle-Earth. I wish we could get a proper triple-A RPG set in this world where you could visit various locations as they were presented in Jackson's movies. Detailed, varied, drenched in environmental storytelling and atmospheric presentation, with great writing and interesting quests... Basically The Witcher 3 but set in Middle-Earth. But what we got in Shadow of Mordor/War is uninteresting to explore, and without wishing to repeat myself too much, the only fun to be had in these open-world maps comes from parkouring around and slaughtering Uruks while playing around with the Nemesis system.

Don't get me wrong, it's damn fun to do those things while they still feel like a novelty, but once that novelty wears off, I feel like there's nothing else of substance to those games.
 

lefty1117

Gold Member
"loosely based on" is a pretty good summation of it, IMO. The Celebrimbor stuff is completely made up, but it somewhat passable because we don't know the details of how he died, only that he was killed when Sauron destroyed Eregion. I mean I guess it's possible he was doomed to a wraithlike existence but you do have to squint at it a bit.
 

Robochobo

Member
They're not even adaptations of Tolkien's work. They are quite honestly their own version due to the agreements they made with the Tolkien estate not to use anything other than names, likenesses, locations, and some backstories. Anything past that is Monolith's own original content.
 
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kyussman

Member
I think you can say it's set in Middle Earth,that's about it,lol.I think that's ok though,I think the games were made in good faith unlike something like the new Amazon show that was made in bad faith and wanted to fuck with Tolkien for ideological reasons.
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
Of course they are not, they are an AC reskin with Nemesis system. The second one even has the same bloat as AC games.
 

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
I prefer Return of the King(movie to game transition is still the hypest shit) and War in the North.

The Middle Earth Shadow of games feel like fanfiction.

Though the best LotR game is probably Lord of the Rings Online.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
They're not even adaptations of Tolkien's work. They are quite honestly their own version due to the agreements they made with the Tolkien estate not to use anything other than names, likenesses, locations, and some backstories. Anything past that is Monolith's own original content.
That's not really what I was getting at, though. What I'm saying is that these games failed to capitalize on their use of the property to make a good game, and instead resorted to making a really dull game and then center it around a gimmick that helped it to stand out somewhat.

I know, I originally wanted to write that these games are shit in the thread title but then everyone would jump at me for making another clickbait thread.
 
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darrylgorn

Member
They're not meant to be but the strong points of those games are the narrative.

The gameplay feels like too much of a grind to get to the interesting bits.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
They're not meant to be but the strong points of those games are the narrative.

The gameplay feels like too much of a grind to get to the interesting bits.
I didn't feel the same way about the story to be honest. I barely remember anything about it at this point, save for the fact that the main hero was killed by some dickhead who worships Sauron, and then got possessed by a spirit of the dude who apparently forged the rings of power. Which is an okay premise I suppose but the writing was just so flabby that I didn't care about any of it.
 
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Laptop1991

Member
Shadow of Mordor is a good game, i really enjoyed it, came out in 2014, i didn't like the sequel, Shadow of War, no where near as good for me.
 

MiguelItUp

Member
I don't think majority of people took the game's story or anything way too seriously. Or pay attention to it really. Outside of that, they were a lot of fun IMO. The nemesis system was SO good. Definitely thought Shadow of Mordor was better than War, but both had great ideas.
 
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ahtlas7

Member
I had fun with both games though they don’t really feel like the Middle Earth universe. Nemesis system (U.S. Patent No. 10,926,179) was really cool too.
 

Umbasaborne

Banned
They both suck tbh. The first one in 2014 was fine I guess because there was still so little to play on the then new ps4 and xbox one. By 2017, no one was interested in the bloated awful middle earth fan fiction they were peddling.
 

flying_sq

Member
I'm not sure about the adaptation of the material, never really been that into LOTOR, but I had a fun time playing the games. It's like if Assassin's Creed was good. I wouldn't mind a third game in the series.
 
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kiphalfton

Member
Only played the first one, but it sucked.

Gameplay is fine, but the "world" itself was boring and should have been fully open world and not hubs.

What the LotR series needs, is a fully open world game, with good missions, characters, different biomes, etc.

But most open world games fall back on crappy side quests to pad out the play time, and always fall short of expectations.
 
Only played the first one, but it sucked.

Gameplay is fine, but the "world" itself was boring and should have been fully open world and not hubs.

What the LotR series needs, is a fully open world game, with good missions, characters, different biomes, etc.

But most open world games fall back on crappy side quests to pad out the play time, and always fall short of expectations.
Lotro does it pretty well. It's an old mmo so the combat is old mmo combat, but the world is superb.
 

bender

What time is it?
Couldn't tell you as I never could make it very far into them. The Assassin's Creed/Batman style combat is fine as a compliment to other game play systems but gets dull really quickly when it is the focal point.
 

Topher

Identifies as young
The first game was fantastic. Felt like it was fine as a side story in Tolkein's world. No one is going to mistake it for the real thing, but overall it is a great game. I wish they would make more like the first and skip all the coop fortress building crap of the second.
 
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PillsOff

Banned
Oh...it is a vicious, aggressive, postmodern, anal rape of Tolkien's work there can be no doubt bout it.

You play this games for the hunger for systemic worlds in AAA open world games(cos it is this n new Zelda games n that is it), but you should not play it for the branding of it.
 
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kuncol02

Banned
Maybe now that Hogwarts showed it can be done (ie a proper open world rpg from a beloved IP)...they will figure out how to do it for Tolkien.

I mean...how it hasn't happened already in any meaningful way is beyond me.
There was LotR RPG in 1990, Troika was also working on one. Tim Cain even shown techdemo of it few days ago on his Youtube channel.
 

Fuz

Banned
I wish Monolith would go back to doing what they're good at. First person shooters.
It's what the company was built on.

07Kz7OC.jpg
Some of those games are among my favourites ever (Shogo, Blood2, NoLF 1&2...)
I didn't remember AvP2 was Monolith's. We played it over LAN with a friend and it was one of the best multiplayer experiences of my life.
Oh...it is a vicious, aggressive postmodern anal rape of Tolkien's work there can be no doubt bout it.

You play this games for the hunger for systemic worlds in AAA open world games(cos it is this n new Zelda games n that is it), but you should not play it for the branding of it.
I like you.
 

Dr. Claus

Banned
The core gameplay of the Monolith Middle-Earth games were fantastic.

They were absolute shit in terms of lore and understanding of the Middle-Earth mythos. However, after having gone through Rings of Power? I would take a thousand sexy Shelob monstrosities over one second of that cancer.
 

kiphalfton

Member
Their next game will be Wonder Woman.....I think that ship has sailed. What a terrible property to have to make a game on.
Would have thought nobody would want to touch the Wonder Woman IP after the shitty DCU sequel.

But yes, I think they're well past FEAR, Condemned, etc. Too bad.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
I wish Monolith would go back to doing what they're good at. First person shooters.
It's what the company was built on.

07Kz7OC.jpg
As much as I would love to see them coming back to those types of games, I don't think the actual designers who worked on those are even in Monolith anymore. It's usually what happens with companies that have been around for as long as they did.
 

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Even saying loosely based on Tolkiens work is a stretch.

Shelobisalady.jpg
 
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