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[Robb]

No one here wants the Switch DS?

I wouldn’t mind, it’s nice to have the screen(s) protected. Although I think that patent is as reliable as the ones we got prior to the Switch reveal..

 

[Celine]

What an absolutely garbage post.

• The Switch didn't have a high barrier to replacement with the 3DS, especially since that device didn't perform nearly as well as the DS.
• The PS4 was NOT 250 when the Switch launched, it was still selling for 300 dollars
• The 3DS launched for 250, so 300 for a handheld that also worked as a hybrid was not out of reach.
  • 400 dollars however is a large jump from 250
  • Switch Lite launched just 2 years later with a launch price of just 200 dollars.
• The more expensive a hybrid is the less likely it will sell as a handheld
• The weaker a hybrid is the less likely it will sell as a console
• 400 dollars puts it square in the realm of consoles rather than handhelds and likely a weak console at that
• That's an expensive upgrade for a lot of people who don't care about graphics in the first place

When Switch launched the people who doubted its viability on the market raised the exact same points you rised hence why I parroted your post.
Neither being less powerful than PS4/XBO while being at a similar price range nor the OG Switch MSRP of $300 being markedly higher than previous successful handheld consoles (3DS debuted at $250 and had to be saved with an early emergency price drop to $170) impacted negatively the Switch' success.
On the contrary Switch ended up selling markedly more than what PS4 could muster.
Your posts also contains the typical fallacy of the ones that don't really understand the Switch' success, by focusing on the single play forms allowed by the hybrid design as a dicothomy instead of recognizing that the true value of the hybrid design is to gives consumers the option to quickly shift to any play style so to adapt to anyone life style.
It's TV mode AND handheld mode AND tabletop mode instead of this OR that.

EDIT:
To show how stupid it is to liken the 3DS to NSW I post below a graph with the cumulative sell-in quarter after quater.
3DS started at $250 but just after launch sales worryingly slowed down a lot, in fact 3DS sold a measly 0.71M in Q2 (this is the reason that the pink line looks almost flat in the beginning).
This unexpected evolution of events prompted Nintendo to do an emergency price cut to $170 five months in.
From the onset the momentum for the Switch was clearly superior and even with the shot in the arm 3DS received (Q3 on ward) it had a hard time to match the NSW pace.
NSW higher price compared to 3DS quick drop to $170 wasn't a problem at all because NSW had much higher perceived value among the mass market due to the new 'hybrid' paradigm.
Between NSW and 3DS there is a huge gulf in consumers' percepted value difference in favour of the former.

 

[jufonuk]

the industry has changed, the landscape of portable consoles is not the same, but we all know that nintendo doesnt care about that and will do whatever they fuck they want.

there is no analyst that can analyse nintendo.

 

[Dodo123]

Super Switch is a terrible name. The masses won’t understand the difference between the regular one and this one. It’ll be the Wii U all over again.

Super Switch sounds very Xbox Series X and PS4 Pro. Just sounds like a souped up version of the old thing.

It always amazes me how these people come to every "Nintendo's next console" thread and spam it with "call it Super Switch, that would be cool"
Ughhhh, let's hope the leadership at the company is not that stupid, narrow-minded and can actually process simple facts.

 

[Celine]

Sony basically stopped manufacturing PS4s during the pandemic despite the pandemic highly inflating the gaming market. While Switch best years were due to a black swan event that kept people indoors and they were fortunate enough to manufacture and ship consoles to meet that demand. I don’t think $400 is a bad price for Switch 2 considering OLED model success but I wouldn’t use Switch success as an indicator for whether the successor will have the same heights. Especially as dev time and budgets will increase for Nintendo, likely leading to fewer releases, and a challenging economic environment in Japan where the Yen has lost 30% of its value in 18 months.

Switch best years were fueled by the pandemic but not "due".
If you check when NSW started to pull over PS4 (it's not immediate to grasp because the two consoles launched in different quarters but the two had a similar pace early on) , that is when it had a recognizable ramp up of pace, you could notice that it happened in CY Q3 2019 (Q11 of the red line), that is before the pandemic erupted in full swing (Q14 of the red line).
Had the PS4 had more stocks it could have taken advantage (on the hardware front I mean) but in CY Q1 2020 (just before the pandemic erupted in full swing) PS4 sell-in worlwide was down a massive 46% YoY.
It happened at the exact same time Sony had planned and was ready to let the slowing down PS4 to die so that PS5 could have a bursting launch/early phase.

As for taking the trend of a previous console and adapting to a new one that would be a pretty silly endevour because what really matter is the context and every console is different.
From what we know about the Switch successor right now from official sources, that is nothing, it could be a worse failure than WiiU just like a higher success than NSW (even if both cases are hard to imagine being likely due to be two opposite extremes of the spectrum).

 

[Sethbacca]

Yup

Look where WiiU revolution got them,

They nailed the hybrid concept. DON’T CHANGE IT

In fact, remove some crap like the sensor for pulse. Fix the goddamn joycons drift. New Nvidia processor in, voila.

Yeah they have this serious habit of doing ridiculous shit like adding advanced tech into a joycon so you can feel an ice cube clinking in a glass and then never using it. Like, just stop Nintendo. You and I both know you're not going to support this and it's just adding unnecessary cost that could have gone toward a better cpu/gpu.

 

[Baki]

Switch best years were fueled by the pandemic but not "due".

It absolutely was.

---

If you check when NSW started to pull over PS4 (it's not immediate to grasp because the two consoles launched in different quarters but the two had a similar pace early on) , that is when it had a recognizable ramp up of pace, you could notice that it happened in CY Q3 2019 (Q11 of the red line), that is before the pandemic erupted in full swing (Q14 of the red line).
Had the PS4 had more stocks it could have taken advantage (on the hardware front I mean) but in CY Q1 2020 (just before the pandemic erupted in full swing) PS4 sell-in worlwide was down a massive 46% YoY.
It happened at the exact same time Sony had planned and was ready to let the slowing down PS4 to die so that PS5 could have a bursting launch/early phase.

As for taking the trend of a previous console and adapting to a new one that would be a pretty silly endevour because what really matter is the context and every console is different.
From what we know about the Switch successor right now from official sources, that is nothing, it could be a worse failure than WiiU just like a higher success than NSW (even if both cases are hard to imagine being likely due to be two opposite extremes of the spectrum).

Switch would have likely continued to have strong performance even without the pandemic, but not to the extent that we saw. Pandemic has reinvigorated the gaming market and has return lapsed gamers back into the fold. Remains to be seen how long this hangover lasts.

 

[Woopah]

Switch specs and DLSS have nothing to do with that.

Is probably a 1080p machine, just like base PS4, but will reach higher resolutions with DLSS.

And I don't believe Nintendo will push Ray Tracing at all. Nintendo already proved their focus in heavily art direction and their sales prove the right decision. Feel free to believe in that.

Nintendo wouldn't have to use RT, but it would still be available for third parties to use.

 

[Fake]

Nintendo wouldn't have to use RT, but it would still be available for third parties to use.

I still don't quite believe in that, take into consideration that next gen consoles are struggling with RT at all.

IDK if Nintendo really think this is worthy. IMO, a Nintendo Switch 2 specs close to base PS4 means that Nintendo first party will run 90% of their games at native 1080p or dynamic 1080p, while third parties can archieve better results using DLSS.

If they really want to do this route, will be impossible to sell Switch 2 without doing the same compromisses as the existence Nintendo Switch. I better prefer to believe their 'next sucessor', aka Nintendo Switch 2, will do that, instead of selling a machine like a PRO model with it is the case.

 

[Zannegan]

Yeah they have this serious habit of doing ridiculous shit like adding advanced tech into a joycon so you can feel an ice cube clinking in a glass and then never using it. Like, just stop Nintendo. You and I both know you're not going to support this and it's just adding unnecessary cost that could have gone toward a better cpu/gpu.

What do you mean never using it? Every Switch controller uses linear actuators for haptic feedback, which is more precise and responsive than old school rumble. Sony followed suit and used the same actuators in the DualSense.

It's not some crazy, esoteric, expensive tech (I think the Steam controller used it). And it's a nice upgrade over the old method. The higher fidelity tactile feedvack makes lockpicking in Skyrim a breeze, for example. Cutting it certainly wouldn't have freed up meaningful resources for the CPU/GPU.

 

[salva]

I was LTTP with the Switch, only getting it in 2022 and first time playing BOTW.
Was so fucking good - I'll be day one with the Switch 2 and it's an absolute no brainer if it's backwards compatible too.
Imagine they released it with a new Castlevania with the same scale of botw, oooooof

 

[Sethbacca]

What do you mean never using it? Every Switch controller uses linear actuators for haptic feedback, which is more precise and responsive than old school rumble. Sony followed suit and used the same actuators in the DualSense.

It's not some crazy, esoteric, expensive tech (I think the Steam controller used it). And it's a nice upgrade over the old method. The higher fidelity tactile feedvack makes lockpicking in Skyrim a breeze, for example. Cutting it certainly wouldn't have freed up meaningful resources for the CPU/GPU.

All i'm saying is that it would have been just as good with a basic feedback. The actual haptic feedback is so poorly used in most games that it may as well not exist.

 

[Woopah]

I still don't quite believe in that, take into consideration that next gen consoles are struggling with RT at all.

IDK if Nintendo really think this is worthy. IMO, a Nintendo Switch 2 specs close to base PS4 means that Nintendo first party will run 90% of their games at native 1080p or dynamic 1080p, while third parties can archieve better results using DLSS.

If they really want to do this route, will be impossible to sell Switch 2 without doing the same compromisses as the existence Nintendo Switch. I better prefer to believe their 'next sucessor', aka Nintendo Switch 2, will do that, instead of selling a machine like a PRO model with it is the case.

The advantage Nintendo has is that they are using Nvidia, which are much better at ray tracing than AMD. With Nvida making a semi custom chip for Nintendo, it makes sense to play to Nvidia's strengths.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Yeah they have this serious habit of doing ridiculous shit like adding advanced tech into a joycon so you can feel an ice cube clinking in a glass and then never using it. Like, just stop Nintendo. You and I both know you're not going to support this and it's just adding unnecessary cost that could have gone toward a better cpu/gpu.

People say this every time about Nintendo’s hardware features.
Then other hardware makers copy them for a couple of interesting games and people are like

 

[Fake]

The advantage Nintendo has is that they are using Nvidia, which are much better at ray tracing than AMD. With Nvida making a semi custom chip for Nintendo, it makes sense to play to Nvidia's strengths.

Ray Tracing doing better on Nvidia than AMD don't take the fact that Ray Tracing is still a very intense mode. Besides, as much Nintendo can upgrade their iGPU, their CPU will still be a low power mobile ARM with is very limited in comparison with x86.

Again, I rather prefer Nintendo to enterily skip RT for now and leave their next generation Nintendo console to do the job. Making Zelda BOTW running at native 1080p and upscaling to 4K TVs using DLSS is a very easy way to archieve.

 

[Sethbacca]

People say this every time about Nintendo’s hardware features.
Then other hardware makers copy them for a couple of interesting games and people are like

Nintendo was absolutely the innovator through the 90s, kinda hit or miss after that. I take your point though. Just saying so much of this shit goes unused even on PS5. How many games actually take advantage of the full controller. The problem is always that usually only one of the big 3 has a feature and usually it's only the first party studios that do anything with it and the third parties mostly just kind ignore it.

I'll admit I may be way off base though since I clearly haven't played every game of the modern era. Anecdotally at least though, shit's underutilized.

 

[tr1p1ex]

No, I didn't give a flying fuck about Wii and its successor, but since I gave a fuck about Switch, naturally I want BC from its successor since I've invested a lot in the platform. Don't be dense.

Exactly. You care about the system and its games. B/C or lack of b/c hasn't influenced your purchase decision. That's why I always poke fun at people declaring they won't buy the next system if it doesn't have b/c. I don't believe it for a second. Because when it comes down to it, they are buying the next system if the new hardware and new games appeal to them. And they aren't going to buy it if the new hardware and new games turn them off no matter if it has b/c.


Also your "investment in the platform" is just as unprotected whether or not you buy a Switch 2 should it have no b/c. You wouldn't gain any more protection by not buying it. YOu would just have your old system. Which of course is the action everyone can take with any platform to "protect" their "investment in the platform."


So I never believe that statement from anyone. If I bet 50 people who say that then I bet I win at least 45 times out of 50. It's a feeling many share on boards before the new system. At a time when they don't know the new system. They haven't seen the new games. They aren't hearing anyone talk about the new games. There's no hype. They are playing the current games still. ...

 

[Woopah]

Ray Tracing doing better on Nvidia than AMD don't take the fact that Ray Tracing is still a very intense mode. Besides, as much Nintendo can upgrade their iGPU, their CPU will still be a low power mobile ARM with is very limited in comparison with x86.

Again, I rather prefer Nintendo to enterily skip RT for now and leave their next generation Nintendo console to do the job. Making Zelda BOTW running at native 1080p and upscaling to 4K TVs using DLSS is a very easy way to archieve.

For me it's about third party support.

For third parties that are using RT on PS5 and Xbox Series, wouldn’t a lack of RT on Switch 2 make it harder for them to port their games to the platform?

 

[tr1p1ex]

No one here wants the Switch DS?

Nah. They went down that path already. And how did the 3ds with 2 screens sell compared to the Switch with 1 screen? Yeah they aren't going 2 screens. And hybrid means the games need to work on both tv and handheld. Supporting 2 screens for handheld and only 1 screen for tv would create a lot of extra work plus add extra cost for...seemingly little gain.

So I think that one is all but guaranteed to not happen.

 

[March Climber]

Nah. They went down that path already. And how did the 3ds with 2 screens sell compared to the Switch with 1 screen?

And hybrid means the games need to work on both tv and handheld. Supporting 2 screens for handheld and only 1 screen for tv would create a lot of extra work plus add extra cost for...seemingly little gain.

If there's any company that would go through these hurdles just to be different, it's Nintendo. We all know they will.

Plus on a side note, it wouldn't be too hard if one screen is detachable. One screen(main) would be docked and the other(secondary) would still be used as a Wii-U like pad while the main unit is on the TV. If I can think of that in minutes, I'm sure Nintendo could think of something better.

 

[tr1p1ex]

If there's any company that would go through these hurdles just to be different, it's Nintendo. We all know they will.

Plus on a side note, it wouldn't be too hard if one screen is detachable. One screen(main) would be docked and the other(secondary) would still be used as a Wii-U like pad while the main unit is on the TV. If I can think of that in minutes, I'm sure Nintendo could think of something better.

Wii U flopped big time. 3ds sold ~80mn. DS sold a ton of course. I know that. But that was pre-iPHone.

Meanwhile Switch is selling almost as much as the DS at a much higher price point and selling software at much higher pricepoints as well. What's the reasoning for going back (to 2 screens?) Just to do something different? That's not enough.

They would have to have some great new ideas for 2 screen gaming and the price would have to be right. The 2nd screen drove up the price of the Wii U by $100. And most games didn't use it all that much. And I think they would be way too shell shocked from the Wii U debacle for execs to greenlight a detachable 2nd screen for the Switch 2.


But I did have my own different creative idea in mind for a 2nd screen. A detachable one too. And that was for tabletop gaming. A lot of cool games could be done with that where you can't see the other screen. Also 2 screens in tabletop mode could give you a bigger screen when laid flat or put side by side. And of course perfect for 2+ joycon (mini-controllers.) Would be fun for families I would think. But...I dismissed and didn't mention it because it wouldn't do much if anything for 1 player and fairly pointless for tv play. And probably would drive up the pricepoint too much. Could be a cool peripheral though I suppose. Although the same things could pretty much be accomplished with a 2nd system. Or really just using iphones as 2nd screens. Something some games actually already do.

 

[tr1p1ex]

I know people say this is all they have to do, but every time Nintendo has just been iterative, they have sold less. SNES sold less than NES. N64 sold less than SNES. GameCube sold less than N64. It wasn't until the revolutionary Wii that they made a comeback. And then the Wii iteration, Wii U, flopped.

Same goes for their handhelds. GBA sold less than the GameBoy. They did the revolutionary DS and had a big hit. Then, the 3DS sold half of what the DS did.

Now, we have a revolutionary hybrid console, which was a huge hit. History tells us that if they just stick to the same model, they will lose a big chunk of their audience this go around. Which I think is why we had reports last year that internally Nintendo was scared to death to announce and launch their next system.

Also, that $400 is going to be a steep asking price if this thing isn't a gigantic leap in graphical fidelity.

yep they need to keep things interesting. a prettier botw is not enough.

But they also need to have something cool and not too costly to put in there. And that's not always the case that there is such a thing available.

 

[Fake]

For me it's about third party support.

For third parties that are using RT on PS5 and Xbox Series, wouldn’t a lack of RT on Switch 2 make it harder for them to port their games to the platform?

You can turn off RT on PC quite easily, so third parties have nothing to worry about. Besides, next gen consoles perfomance mode usually have RT disable, so I presume after they stop making PS4 games they gonna re-use the next gen perfomance mode as a base to port the Nintendo Switch version.

Right now they use the base PS4 to export the code to NS.

 

[Happosai]

If there's any company that would go through these hurdles just to be different, it's Nintendo. We all know they will.

Plus on a side note, it wouldn't be too hard if one screen is detachable. One screen(main) would be docked and the other(secondary) would still be used as a Wii-U like pad while the main unit is on the TV. If I can think of that in minutes, I'm sure Nintendo could think of something better.

I could see them doing something dual screen again and it not flopping either. It'd also give them a chance to port some DS /3DS games over to the predecessor remastered. There's more than a niche that'd pay for that.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

No one here wants the Switch DS?

There's been a recent rumor about it and of course the patent from a few months ago.

No thanks

I would be fine with it if this was a possibility:

It would be great for backward compatibility with DS and 3DS games. Where they can have a DS and 3DS App through through Nintendo Online Service. Or third parties can rerelease HD Remasters of their DS and 3DS games on the eShop

 

[KXVXII9X]

Spot on. Just like before the "Switch" was announced officially, speculation was rampant - and NO ONE, no one was right. This is all just guessing at this point. Truth is, Nintendo's wall of secrecy is the best in the industry, and no one except Nintendo knows what's in store for their next hardware.

I was right. I believed in it day 1. The first several pages on the Switch Neogaf OT thread however...

People were very tunnel visioned and didn't understand that there were a lot of people who preferred handheld gaming for a myriad of reasons. It was already popular in Japan. There was also a lot of people with chronic pain and disabilities who found it easier to play in more comfortable situations. People didn't understand that you didn't need to take it outside to make use of its portability.

I think Nintendo trying new things allows them to have higher highs while occasionally having some sinkers.

I lost completely all respect for analyst during the Switch launch. People were at my throat. It created a bunch of people who were so sure it would fail. I don't think most people even know what they want.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

I was right. I believed in it day 1. The first several pages on the Switch Neogaf OT thread however...

People were very tunnel visioned and didn't understand that there were a lot of people who preferred handheld gaming for a myriad of reasons. It was already popular in Japan. There was also a lot of people with chronic pain and disabilities who found it easier to play in more comfortable situations. People didn't understand that you didn't need to take it outside to make use of its portability.

I think Nintendo trying new things allows them to have higher highs while occasionally having some sinkers.

I lost completely all respect for analyst during the Switch launch. People were at my throat. It created a bunch of people who were so sure it would fail. I don't think most people even know what they want.

Agreed there

I was one of the people who knew Switch would succeed. I mostly play Switch/Steam nowadays. I had my Switch since 2017. I play the Switch on the go and on the TV around 50/50.

All I want from a Switch 2 is XBONE/PS4 level of graphics paired up with modern hardware and I'll be happy

It's the reason why I'm going to get the Steamdeck OLED this year. I like having my Steam backlog on the go and I can use the dock to play on the TV too

 

[Marvel14]

In absolute numbers? I doubt that. Nintendo will definitely opt for a lower power profile which means that even on presumed cutting edge 4nm fab, it will have difficulties matching SD in pure theoretical performance. With that said, Switch 2 does not need to meet SD's technical performance to yield similar or even superior results. This due platform-specific game development which SD does not have the luxury of.

I'm not a tech expert but when Switch came out it was using 2 year old components like the Tegra.

The new Switch will release over 2 years after the SteamDeck so.....

 

[Melon Husk]

1-Bigger handles 2- bigger screen that slides up like this please (don't need the keyboard)

3- wireless "second screen" TV casting and the gimmick factor is satisfied.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

Make it the same as the current switch but more powerful.

Done.

Nintendo will obviously charge whatever they can get away with, but I think £€$400 is too much unless the hardware really wows. And because it's Nintendo, I think that's unlikely.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Makes sense, I predict it'll be like DS to 3DS with some kind of Innovation, not sure what it could be other than some sort of Pseudo non headset-VR with the Joy-Cons like some patents suggest

That honestly is probably the best comparison and likely what Switch 2 will be. Just do the same thing a bit better.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

The appeal of the Switch comes from it's low price, it would need to justify being priced at $400.

The justification being you can't play Nintendo 1st party games anywhere else. It'll still sell like hotcakes at $400.

 

[Sethbacca]

No one here wants the Switch DS?

I want a Switch no S. Thing ain’t leaving my tv anyway. I’d rather not have to pay for a screen that’s never gonna get used.

 

[tr1p1ex]

No thanks

I would be fine with it if this was a possibility:

It would be great for backward compatibility with DS and 3DS games. Where they can have a DS and 3DS App through through Nintendo Online Service. Or third parties can rerelease HD Remasters of their DS and 3DS games on the eShop

just have to hold Switch vertically to get that. It would help if the included a vertical stand for doing this tablestop style and/or let you attach joycons to the sides when held vertically.

 

[Tams]

I'm up for a dual screen.

If they do that, then they'll have managed to get the amazing asynchronous gameplay mechanic to work as you'd always have two displays available.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

just have to hold Switch vertically to get that. It would help if the included a vertical stand for doing this tablestop style and/or let you attach joycons to the sides when held vertically.

That would be a Unique and Weird solution lol

 

[tr1p1ex]

That would be a Unique and Weird solution lol

the other reality for most DS/3DS games is they can just give do what they are doing with Luigi's Mansion 2. Remaking/remastering/porting it to Switch and its 1 screen.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

the other reality for most DS/3DS games is they can just give do what they are doing with Luigi's Mansion 2. Remaking/remastering/porting it to Switch and its 1 screen.

BTW Can't wait for Luigi Mansion 2. I love Luigi Mansion 3 and never played the previous games. I just wish Luigi's Mansion 2 wasn't a HD Remaster and had the graphics of Luigi's Mansion 3

 

[MR ARCADE FOREVER]

BTW Can't wait for Luigi Mansion 2. I love Luigi Mansion 3 and never played the previous games. I just wish Luigi's Mansion 2 wasn't a HD Remaster and had the graphics of Luigi's Mansion 3

LM 3 was amazing. I never played any other LM games. 2 looks pretty decent and will look great in HD, even though not as good as 3....

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Some people ITT need to get their expectations straight. This is going to be a $400 console that Nintendo is going to turn a profit on at launch, because they haven't done subsidized hardware for over a decade. I don't expect anything more powerful than a Steam Deck, and I'll be there day 1.

 

[StereoVsn]

Exactly. You care about the system and its games. B/C or lack of b/c hasn't influenced your purchase decision. That's why I always poke fun at people declaring they won't buy the next system if it doesn't have b/c. I don't believe it for a second. Because when it comes down to it, they are buying the next system if the new hardware and new games appeal to them. And they aren't going to buy it if the new hardware and new games turn them off no matter if it has b/c.


Also your "investment in the platform" is just as unprotected whether or not you buy a Switch 2 should it have no b/c. You wouldn't gain any more protection by not buying it. YOu would just have your old system. Which of course is the action everyone can take with any platform to "protect" their "investment in the platform."


So I never believe that statement from anyone. If I bet 50 people who say that then I bet I win at least 45 times out of 50. It's a feeling many share on boards before the new system. At a time when they don't know the new system. They haven't seen the new games. They aren't hearing anyone talk about the new games. There's no hype. They are playing the current games still. ...

Times are changing so to speak. Digital libraries and general BC is more important to folks and we have very good examples with PS5 and XSX (and P5 No disk and XSS digital) carrying their libraries forward.

Especially in the early years of the console when software is going to be sparse having good BC is quite important. We shall see what Nintendo thinks in the subject in a few months I guess.

 

[tr1p1ex]

Times are changing so to speak. Digital libraries and general BC is more important to folks and we have very good examples with PS5 and XSX (and P5 No disk and XSS digital) carrying their libraries forward.

Especially in the early years of the console when software is going to be sparse having good BC is quite important. We shall see what Nintendo thinks in the subject in a few months I guess.

Well I think it is all but guaranteed they will have b/c and have said so many times before because they have done it plenty in the past. At least into the subsequent generation. Just didn't happen with Switch because the changes were too great.

But my point was I never believe anyone when they say they won't buy the new console if it doesn't have b/c.

And I listed why.

IT's just a lot of posturing imo. I don't believe for a second the big fans are going to not play the newest games if they think those games are must play games because the console doesn't have b/c. It's nonsense if you ask me.

 

[Marvel14]

Some people ITT need to get their expectations straight. This is going to be a $400 console that Nintendo is going to turn a profit on at launch, because they haven't done subsidized hardware for over a decade. I don't expect anything more powerful than a Steam Deck, and I'll be there day 1.

I agree and yet.....I think we are still looking at two broad scenarios:

1. Switch 2 has a new blue ocean differentiator (like 3D) which allows them to limit how much they chase raw power and rely instead on their enhanced USP.

2. This really is just a higher powered Switch - in which case the current install base needs enough of a differentiator to upgrade.

Nintendo also faces the risk that a new Steam Deck (or other device like the RoG Ally) nails form factor or adds a new USP that cannibalizes the Switch's consumer base.


This article shows that the Steamdeck does "ok" with UE5. I expect Nintendo to want to match or even slightly improve on that. I still think their aim (without a massive blue ocean differentiator) will be that most UE5 games in the Switch2's first 5 years are acceptably playable on it (30fps on low or med settings).

Is Unreal Engine 5 'too big' for Steam Deck?

If Unreal Engine 5 is the future of games, how well can Steam Deck cope? Digital Foundry investigates.

www.eurogamer.net

 

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

That would be a Unique and Weird solution lol

Something like this has been done already:



Ever since the NX was rumored to have a screen with detachable controllers, I dreamed it could be also held vertically. That would have been such a practical solution to have DS-like screen layout on a single screen.

 

[BlackTron]

I agree and yet.....I think we are still looking at two broad scenarios:

1. Switch 2 has a new blue ocean differentiator (like 3D) which allows them to limit how much they chase raw power and rely instead on their enhanced USP.

2. This really is just a higher powered Switch - in which case the current install base needs enough of a differentiator to upgrade.

Nintendo also faces the risk that a new Steam Deck (or other device like the RoG Ally) nails form factor or adds a new USP that cannibalizes the Switch's consumer base.


This article shows that the Steamdeck does "ok" with UE5. I expect Nintendo to want to match or even slightly improve on that. I still think their aim (without a massive blue ocean differentiator) will be that most UE5 games in the Switch2's first 5 years are acceptably playable on it (30fps on low or med settings).

Is Unreal Engine 5 'too big' for Steam Deck?

If Unreal Engine 5 is the future of games, how well can Steam Deck cope? Digital Foundry investigates.

www.eurogamer.net

 

The #1 USP of Nintendo is 1p Nintendo games. Any other USP is secondary to this. Handhelds like Steam Deck or ROG Ally will never really offer any Nintendo product competition. They can be successful in a vacuum outside of their effect on Nintendo, which is nothing.

 

[StereoVsn]

Well I think it is all but guaranteed they will have b/c and have said so many times before because they have done it plenty in the past. At least into the subsequent generation. Just didn't happen with Switch because the changes were too great.

But my point was I never believe anyone when they say they won't buy the new console if it doesn't have b/c.

And I listed why.

IT's just a lot of posturing imo. I don't believe for a second the big fans are going to not play the newest games if they think those games are must play games because the console doesn't have b/c. It's nonsense if you ask me.

I think people won’t jump in as quickly. Basically with full BC it’s easy to find games to play/replay, perhaps even at higher fidelity, when console is launched.

But without it, people can wait. So sales for first couple years would be affected. Paying $400+ tax for a console with just 1 or 2 games you want is a lot bigger ask vs having a gigantic BC library.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Man, I hope this is wrong. I was excited for a super powerful Nintendo Switch 2 that could potentially eat PlayStation's and Xbox's lunch a little bit.

What a trajectory so far though. We have come from "Switch 2 is playing FFVII Remake on PS5 graphics" to "It'll be an iteration rather than a revolution."

 

[StereoVsn]

Man, I hope this is wrong. I was excited for a super powerful Nintendo Switch 2 that could potentially eat PlayStation's and Xbox's lunch a little bit.

What a trajectory so far though. We have come from "Switch 2 is playing FFVII Remake on PS5 graphics" to "It'll be an iteration rather than a revolution."

These are not mutually exclusive. By iteration it was meant Nintendo wasn’t going to throw more gimmicks.

From power perspective the speculation was always around PS4 raster capability with modern architecture on top including DLSS.

Considering it is a hybrid device there is no way to run at PS5 equivalent levels with mobile TDP requirements and limitations of current tech.

 

[MR ARCADE FOREVER]

Man, I hope this is wrong. I was excited for a super powerful Nintendo Switch 2 that could potentially eat PlayStation's and Xbox's lunch a little bit.

What a trajectory so far though. We have come from "Switch 2 is playing FFVII Remake on PS5 graphics" to "It'll be an iteration rather than a revolution."

You missed the point though, revolution means something completely different like the Wii, interaction the same switch but more powerful, but not that powerful you know Nintendo got out of the power race long time ago...

 

[Marvel14]

The #1 USP of Nintendo is 1p Nintendo games. Any other USP is secondary to this. Handhelds like Steam Deck or ROG Ally will never really offer any Nintendo product competition. They can be successful in a vacuum outside of their effect on Nintendo, which is nothing.

Right and when the Wii U came out and offered mostly Nintendo IPs (including the evergreen Mario Kart 8, the super popular in Japan Splatoon and also a new unique 3d Mario, a new DK Country and an open world zelda in development )--- how well did that work out for Nintendo?