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People bitching and whining about "controversial" game design decisions... STFU and enjoy the game, and if you can't, play something else

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LakeOf9

Member
My favorite trend in the last decade has been armchair developers crying and bitching about gameplay and design decisions in some of the best received and loved games of all time, and claiming they could do better without some very integral things that make those games exactly what they are. We have multiple examples of this kind of decision, of course. We have people who bitch about the deliberate controls and cinematic stylings of Red Dead Redemption 2. We have people who bitch about weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. We have people who bitch about difficulty levels in the Dark Souls games (plus Elden Ring, Sekiro, Bloodborne).

Those last two are especially prevalent everywhere. It's impossible to talk about Elden Ring or Zelda without some "ackchually" keyboard warrior coming in to hijack the discussion and tell us about why the games are terrible because they lack difficulty options or because they have weapon durability, both of those decisions ones very deliberately made by the developers to make the games they wanted to make.

These games are ones that thrive on friction for the player. They're not meant to be polished to the extent that they tell the player everything and are afraid of the player ever feeling lost or frustrated. They're not like modern Ubisoft or Sony games, that mark everything on the map and tell you how many collectibles or quests in a region are left, that shout out the solution to a puzzle or encounter right away because they are so afraid players will get annoyed at the game and stop playing. Being annoyed and trying to figure out how to conquer the thing that annoys you is a huge thing in these games.

I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games.

Maybe I am rambling, but what do you think GAF? I figure if there is any one place that would understand what I am saying, it would be this one.
 
obligatory:
qZkA8ug.jpeg
 

Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
All I ask for is people to put some effort into their posts. Make a point that is somewhat interesting to read. I honestly don't care if you intensely hate something, or intensely love something. I just want an opinion worth engaging with and talking about. Some of the harshest critics on here write things that are entertaining to read. Some of the people who love everything do the same. Everyone's opinion is their own.
 
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Fbh

Member
Drive by shit posting sucks.
But if people are presenting their issues or opinions about a game in a well articulated manner I don't see the issue.

It's what makes gaming discussion fun. Why would you want every thread about a popular game to just be a circle jerk where everyone praises every aspect of it ?
 

Del_X

Member
I dunno, it's not like they can just get their money back (unless they're on Steam and sometimes Xbox)
 
I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games...
well, when something's controversial, it's gonna trigger discussion. &, yes, people's tolerance for design elements they find flawed will vary individually. but, more often than not, i find folks up here to be pretty reasonable in being able to separate their own personal preferences from those of the developers. there're always gonna be some people who bitch, but what the hell - you buy something, you're greatly displeased, you bitch. it's fine. & your doing so needn't affect me, & vice versa...
 
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SmokedMeat

Gamer™
Weapon durability in BotW sucks.
Doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate the game as a whole. Even though it lacked the damn dungeons that make Zelda games so fun.
 

//DEVIL//

Member
My favorite trend in the last decade has been armchair developers crying and bitching about gameplay and design decisions in some of the best received and loved games of all time, and claiming they could do better without some very integral things that make those games exactly what they are. We have multiple examples of this kind of decision, of course. We have people who bitch about the deliberate controls and cinematic stylings of Red Dead Redemption 2. We have people who bitch about weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. We have people who bitch about difficulty levels in the Dark Souls games (plus Elden Ring, Sekiro, Bloodborne).

Those last two are especially prevalent everywhere. It's impossible to talk about Elden Ring or Zelda without some "ackchually" keyboard warrior coming in to hijack the discussion and tell us about why the games are terrible because they lack difficulty options or because they have weapon durability, both of those decisions ones very deliberately made by the developers to make the games they wanted to make.

These games are ones that thrive on friction for the player. They're not meant to be polished to the extent that they tell the player everything and are afraid of the player ever feeling lost or frustrated. They're not like modern Ubisoft or Sony games, that mark everything on the map and tell you how many collectibles or quests in a region are left, that shout out the solution to a puzzle or encounter right away because they are so afraid players will get annoyed at the game and stop playing. Being annoyed and trying to figure out how to conquer the thing that annoys you is a huge thing in these games.

I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games.

Maybe I am rambling, but what do you think GAF? I figure if there is any one place that would understand what I am saying, it would be this one.
I hope you are one of those people who got fired from their job recently due to an ugly or stupid design you decided to woke and do.

The best joy I'll have is seeing more of your tears.

oh, and I'll say whatever I want. so fu and your deliberate decisions.
 

LakeOf9

Member
I hope you are one of those people who got fired from their job recently due to an ugly or stupid design you decided to woke and do.

The best joy I'll have is seeing more of your tears.

oh, and I'll say whatever I want. so fu and your deliberate decisions.
lol wtf

Opinions are fine, I don't think that's what OP is referring to; people who drive by shitpost or proclaim something is terrible because ultimately the game simply isn't for them can indeed kindly fuck off.
Yes, thank you for understanding what I meant
 
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Killjoy-NL

Gold Member
Meh, I don't take anything here seriously.

As far as I'm concerned, Gaffers don't even exist outside of Gaf, so no opinion bothers me.

And if we had an echo-chamber, there would be nothing to discuss. Sounds pretty boring.
 

Bernardougf

Member
My favorite trend in the last decade has been armchair developers crying and bitching about gameplay and design decisions in some of the best received and loved games of all time, and claiming they could do better without some very integral things that make those games exactly what they are. We have multiple examples of this kind of decision, of course. We have people who bitch about the deliberate controls and cinematic stylings of Red Dead Redemption 2. We have people who bitch about weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. We have people who bitch about difficulty levels in the Dark Souls games (plus Elden Ring, Sekiro, Bloodborne).

Those last two are especially prevalent everywhere. It's impossible to talk about Elden Ring or Zelda without some "ackchually" keyboard warrior coming in to hijack the discussion and tell us about why the games are terrible because they lack difficulty options or because they have weapon durability, both of those decisions ones very deliberately made by the developers to make the games they wanted to make.

These games are ones that thrive on friction for the player. They're not meant to be polished to the extent that they tell the player everything and are afraid of the player ever feeling lost or frustrated. They're not like modern Ubisoft or Sony games, that mark everything on the map and tell you how many collectibles or quests in a region are left, that shout out the solution to a puzzle or encounter right away because they are so afraid players will get annoyed at the game and stop playing. Being annoyed and trying to figure out how to conquer the thing that annoys you is a huge thing in these games.

I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games.

Maybe I am rambling, but what do you think GAF? I figure if there is any one place that would understand what I am saying, it would be this one.
If you put it a gun in my head and ask me to choose the most overratade game between Elden Ring and Breath of the Wild
.. I would just say to pull the trigger and end my misery.
 
My favorite trend in the last decade has been armchair developers crying and bitching about gameplay and design decisions in some of the best received and loved games of all time, and claiming they could do better without some very integral things that make those games exactly what they are. We have multiple examples of this kind of decision, of course. We have people who bitch about the deliberate controls and cinematic stylings of Red Dead Redemption 2. We have people who bitch about weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. We have people who bitch about difficulty levels in the Dark Souls games (plus Elden Ring, Sekiro, Bloodborne).

Those last two are especially prevalent everywhere. It's impossible to talk about Elden Ring or Zelda without some "ackchually" keyboard warrior coming in to hijack the discussion and tell us about why the games are terrible because they lack difficulty options or because they have weapon durability, both of those decisions ones very deliberately made by the developers to make the games they wanted to make.

These games are ones that thrive on friction for the player. They're not meant to be polished to the extent that they tell the player everything and are afraid of the player ever feeling lost or frustrated. They're not like modern Ubisoft or Sony games, that mark everything on the map and tell you how many collectibles or quests in a region are left, that shout out the solution to a puzzle or encounter right away because they are so afraid players will get annoyed at the game and stop playing. Being annoyed and trying to figure out how to conquer the thing that annoys you is a huge thing in these games.

I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games.

Maybe I am rambling, but what do you think GAF? I figure if there is any one place that would understand what I am saying, it would be this one.

As always, people who describe criticism or simply stating something they don't like about a game (an opinion they aren't forcing you at all to share) as "bitching" and "whining" are less mature then my 2 year old cousin.

This is just this:

images


Because I'm not a an actual toddler, I believe that art, being subjective, should lead to places where people are allowed to enjoy things, and speak on those feelings, but also dislike things, and again, speak on those feelings.

Without stupid man-children like you just doing the aforementioned meme, calling people who dare to not share your opinion "whiners", or going "you just don't get it maaaaaaan".

I will just give this quick example.
Back when everyone was overwhelmingly down on Darksiders 3, for being a Dark Souls clone, and being mediocre, I myself enjoyed it to the point I gave it an 8/10.

And not for a single second the thought that the people complaining about the game were "bitching" or "whining" about the design of the game crossed my mind. Those are their opinions. I listened to them, I just disagree.

I also never felt threatened by those opinions. Gave the game an 8. Still an 8.

If you think RDR 2 is a masterpiece, that's cool. I believe it's one of the worst games ever made (Gameplay wise). We disagree, strongly. And that's okay.

It could be that simple. You didn't need to call people like me whining bitches, and I didn't need to call you a stupid man-child, but here we are.
 

LakeOf9

Member
If you think RDR 2 is a masterpiece, that's cool. I believe it's one of the worst games ever made (Gameplay wise). We disagree, strongly. And that's okay.

It could be that simple. You didn't need to call people like me whining bitches, and I didn't need to call you a stupid man-child, but here we are.
People who substantiate their opinions I have no problems with.

people who come in with drive by posts to hijack discussions are the ones I am talking about in the OP.
 

sloppyjoe_gamer

Gold Member
My favorite trend in the last decade has been armchair developers crying and bitching about gameplay and design decisions in some of the best received and loved games of all time, and claiming they could do better without some very integral things that make those games exactly what they are. We have multiple examples of this kind of decision, of course. We have people who bitch about the deliberate controls and cinematic stylings of Red Dead Redemption 2. We have people who bitch about weapon durability in Breath of the Wild. We have people who bitch about difficulty levels in the Dark Souls games (plus Elden Ring, Sekiro, Bloodborne).

Those last two are especially prevalent everywhere. It's impossible to talk about Elden Ring or Zelda without some "ackchually" keyboard warrior coming in to hijack the discussion and tell us about why the games are terrible because they lack difficulty options or because they have weapon durability, both of those decisions ones very deliberately made by the developers to make the games they wanted to make.

These games are ones that thrive on friction for the player. They're not meant to be polished to the extent that they tell the player everything and are afraid of the player ever feeling lost or frustrated. They're not like modern Ubisoft or Sony games, that mark everything on the map and tell you how many collectibles or quests in a region are left, that shout out the solution to a puzzle or encounter right away because they are so afraid players will get annoyed at the game and stop playing. Being annoyed and trying to figure out how to conquer the thing that annoys you is a huge thing in these games.

I don't know, to me a gamer who truly appreciates the art and craft of game development should be appreciative of how well put together the FromSoft Souls game, the open world Zelda games, or the utter masterpiece that is RDR2, are. Yes, they have their design elements that are controversial, and yes there are some players who can't handle any inconvenience working on ludicrous mods or cheats that add difficulty levels or better controls or unbreakable weapons or what not, but that's very much not the point, and against the entire design philosophy of these games.

Maybe I am rambling, but what do you think GAF? I figure if there is any one place that would understand what I am saying, it would be this one.

And then we have posters that bitch about people bitching about those things, thus making the poster AKA you....as much to blame for bitching about things.
 

Mr Hyde

Member
When it comes to difficulty in Souls-games (or any hard game really) I agree. In the case of Breath of the Wild I disagree. The weapon breaking mechanic is a legit criticism. It takes away a lot of the fun in combat encounters. It's mitigated somewhat in Tears, where you can fuse weapons, but it's still a shitty mechanic.
 

Ristifer

Member
As others have said, just use the ignore function. Problem solved. If you're finding that you're ignoring more people than you are able to see, then maybe you're a dick.
 
10 years ago the new AC would have been lauded, but since the past years it's funny to try to bankrupt a company, we have this
 

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
no U stfu
 
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