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[kingfey]

Halo Infinite's lack of updates is forcing its biggest streamers to turn to other games

"We have long periods of nothing."

www.pcgamer.com

Halo Infinite's lack of updates is severely impacting its multiplayer base, according to streamers, with some of the biggest Halo Twitch channels abandoning it in favour of other games.

A report (opens in new tab) published by Rock Paper Shotgun details how, in the four months since Halo Infinite's launch, peak Twitch viewing for Halo Infinite has dropped from 200k to 10k, with streamers calling it an abnormally low level of engagement for a live-service game with a big name attached to it.

The problem, say the streamers RPS spoke with, is that the game launched with many missing features that are typically staples in a Halo game. Moreover, 343's reintroduction of these features is both too slow and not exciting enough to get people coming back. This includes major features such as campaign co-op and Forge, alongside popular multiplayer modes like Team Doubles and Shotty Snipers. And this is merely stuff players expect from a Halo game, let alone actual new content, of which there hasn't been any since the game launched late last year.

Consequently, the long-term viability of Halo: Infinite as a live service game is increasingly under threat. "Unless we start to see bigger features added the seasons will just be small upticks that fade away in a month or so" Halo content creator Arrash told RPS, while another Halo content creator, KevinKoolx, summed up the problem with "We have long periods of nothing." Some larger Halo content creators, such as Hrebinka, the host of LateNightGaming, have moved away from their main game, instead making videos about Call of Duty, or streaming Elden Ring.

343 is at least aware of community frustrations. Answering questions on Reddit(opens in new tab) over the weekend, community director Brian Jarrad stated the Halo Infinite team is "not happy to be unable to meet player and community expectations" and said that the studio will have "more to share" on Infinite's upcoming Season Two "in the coming weeks."

Halo Infinite's struggles encapsulate the challenge of maintaining an audience for modern multiplayer and live-service games, which create ever-escalating demands that can cause studios to enter a never-ending period of crunch(opens in new tab). It also highlights the pitfalls of Infinite's attempt to be many different things to many different players, simultaneously an open world singleplayer game, a classic Halo experience, a modern-feeling shooter, and a live-service. Infinite does many of these things well(opens in new tab), and the actual core of the multiplayer is fantastic. But Infinite was in development for so long that the ground has shifted beneath 343's feet, and the studio clearly wasn't prepared to deliver the kind of long-term multiplayer experience that modern audiences expect.

Hopefully the studio can revert course soon, but it seems that, at least from the perspective of the game's major content creators, the clock is very much ticking.

 

[kingfey]

MS at this point, should fire 343i leaders. They are incapable of utilizing MS biggest mascot, and ruining to the ground.

 

[M1chl]

Final SP game is mostly works of Saber Interactive, the final push and so on. Also sorry for libcuck take, but MS has to stop treat gaming development as if it would be some project at Google. I think that even that weasel reported on this issue. H1B workers are bad idea for such large project. And you know, it's kind of asshole thing to do. You can boast about your "diversity" all you want, but that's just a facade. Most of the work in 343 was done by workers who worker there for a half-year and then back to your country

 

[DryvBy]

To think, this was the player's GOTY last year.

 

[Jennings]

It'll be back better than ever. This is just a temporary slump. And when the game updates, all these streamers and their viewers will return too. The game is out right now and already justifies the $10 it costs to play it via Gamepass, and future updates will add even more value. Everybody will love it.

 

[ReBurn]

Poor streamers. Microsoft isn't releasing content fast enough for their streams to make money.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

MS at this point, should fire 343i leaders. They are incapable of utilizing MS biggest mascot, and ruining to the ground.

You assume the problems with 343 don't stem from Microsoft itself.

This is a studio that Microsoft created in-house, not a studio they bought externally.

The problem with trying to fix a game studio is the length of time it takes to release a product and the reputation the studio has already made for itself. Look at glass door and see what people think of the studio. Then ask yourself how many studios Microsoft has nurtured internally.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

MS at this point, should fire 343i leaders. They are incapable of utilizing MS biggest mascot, and ruining to the ground.

Is it really just 343i leadership to blame, though? I mean, Microsoft is the publisher; they're the ones who had the power to dictate the model for the game business-wise, just like Sony with GT7's MTX. But at least GT7 is making changes there, I've not heard anything about Halo curbing back its MTX pricing scheme or the fact a lot of stuff you can only get via buying it.

Ultimately I think there's too much disconnect between Matt Booty and leads at the XGS studios; they are simply way too hands-off and don't seem to have much creative guidance for the studios. And some of the XGS studios really need that more than others, like 343i. But what kind of guidance can someone who comes from Minecraft give them, creatively, realistically?

It seems like the problem is twofold in that respect.

It'll be back better than ever. This is just a temporary slump. And when the game updates, all these streamers and their viewers will return too. The game is out right now and already justifies the $10 it costs to play it via Gamepass, and future updates will add even more value. Everybody will love it.

Is this a new meme?

 

[BennyBlanco]

the multiplayer is fun, there just isn't enough maps or reason to keep playing, sadly

343 stinks

 

[Batiman]

To think, this was the player's GOTY last year.

Why not?

 

[JTCx]

neogaf goty tho ;(

 

[Hezekiah]

This is news? The stats said it all, the game has been rapidly slipping down most played charts, and there is tension between fans and the devs.

 

[ZehDon]

The problem with this "live service" is that 343i thinks that finishing missing content is the same as adding new content.

"We're adding a brand new mode - King of the Hill!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new playlist - Slayer!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new feature - Campaign co-op!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.

Their "live service" is just... finishing the game. Forge, Firefight, Customs, Playlists; all of this is missing content, but they're pretending that releasing it piece meal constitutes a live service worth paying for. No one missing feature is enough to rejuvenate this dead game on its own, but they're stuck pretending that it is. Which means Halo Infinite still has years of work ahead of it before it'll be where it should've launched at... and no one will come back to play a cross-gen F2P shooter limping on outdated tech two years from now when we're knee deep in next-gen only games that make Halo Infinite look even more embarrassing. If we thought Halo 5 was the low point, I suspect we've still got new lows to enjoy thanks to this disaster of a game.

 

[Craig of War]

I beat the campaign then i dip out of there will come back once they add more content there are too many other games to play for me to care much for Halo right now

 

[Hendrick's]

All of this is true, but it's good enough to bounce back.

 

[Banjo64]

Ultimately I think there's too much disconnect between Matt Booty and leads at the XGS studios; they are simply way too hands-off and don't seem to have much creative guidance for the studios. And some of the XGS studios really need that more than others, like 343i.

My suspicion too.

They’ve shit themselves so badly from the reaction to their mishandling of Lionhead, Bungie and (probably) Rare in their early days that they’re terrified to crack the whip. They’ve gone too far in the other direction.

Some driven studios like Bethesda Game Studios, Playground and Double Fine will be fine with that, but some of the others could seriously flounder.

There needs to be some level of overview and control from the top, just look at Nintendo and Sony.

 

[MiguelItUp]

It's honestly really sad, the game had a ton of potential, but it fell right on its face. I still have no idea how its development was so poorly handled. It really just makes me feel like 343i just isn't capable. All the delays, all the help from different studios, and the "final product" was still under cooked in a variety of ways.

We COULD see it bounce back, I mean, we've seen plenty "phoenix rising from the ashes" examples. But, I dunno, I feel like a lot of those devs showed a turn around by now that these guys just... aren't doing ATM. Hopefully that changes.

 

[kingfey]

You assume the problems with 343 don't stem from Microsoft itself.

This is a studio that Microsoft created in-house, not a studio they bought externally.

The problem with trying to fix a game studio is the length of time it takes to release a product and the reputation the studio has already made for itself. Look at glass door and see what people think of the studio. Then ask yourself how many studios Microsoft has nurtured internally.

MS has hands off approach with their studios. 343i is abusing that policy.

 

[kingfey]

Ultimately I think there's too much disconnect between Matt Booty and leads at the XGS studios; they are simply way too hands-off and don't seem to have much creative guidance for the studios. And some of the XGS studios really need that more than others, like 343i. But what kind of guidance can someone who comes from Minecraft give them, creatively, realistically?

That is the problem. The hands off approach is not working. MS/XBOX is letting their studios on their own, to do whatever they want to do. This creates problems such as 343i not giving a crap about halo, Rare not touching their IPs, and Mojang not focusing on xbox platform like it supposed to do.

 

[Shmunter]

Someone’s boneing someone for this just to continue indefinitely.

 

[Jaybe]

Bonnie is by far her most excited when talking about Halo tv series. I think that trickles down.

 

[Nydius]

My Xbox friends list largely consists of people I met playing various forms of Halo dating all the way back to Halo 2. Very few of them are playing Infinite. Most of them fell off around January, about the same time I got bored with it. It baffles me just how light on content the multiplayer side of the game is and how 343i's only responses have been long-winded forms of "we're listening and working on some things, be patient". We already know Season 2 is only going to add two maps -- one to the arena, one to Big Team Battle -- and that's it. They're announcing the return of staple modes like King of the Hill as some major feature. Meanwhile, campaign coop and mission replay got delayed again.

Back in December/January I posted a comment over on reddit saying I figured the game would be 'feature complete' in a year -- by holiday 2022. With 343i's glacial pace, I now think it won't be feature complete until spring/summer 2023...

All the delays, all the help from different studios, and the "final product" was still under cooked in a variety of ways.

Don't forget the revolving door of contractors. That's a large reason why the game is in the state it's in. 343i follows Microsoft's lead in hiring a bunch of contractors and then dumping them as soon as their segment of the project is done, leading to a heavily fragmented project where even management isn't entirely sure what's been done when or where.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

My suspicion too.

They’ve shit themselves so badly from the reaction to their mishandling of Lionhead, Bungie and (probably) Rare in their early days that they’re terrified to crack the whip. They’ve gone too far in the other direction.

Some driven studios like Bethesda Game Studios, Playground and Double Fine will be fine with that, but some of the others could seriously flounder.

There needs to be some level of overview and control from the top, just look at Nintendo and Sony.

Sadly you can't have overhead if you don't have the right kind of person overseeing the studios. I think it's time to replace Matt Booty; he might be better served at Rare on the Sea of Thieves upper management team but his Minecraft expertise and super hands-off approach isn't fitting for a good number of the 1P teams.

Bethesda will be safe from this type of stuff because they're under Zenimax and Zenimax is under Pete Hines rather than Matt Booty. I think you give Zenimax more budget and time for polish and they're set because all of their studios seem to have pretty good leadership and workflow. There's only maybe a handful of XGS studios with that namely Coalition, Turn 10, Playground, Double Fine, Ninja Theory and Obsidian.

But even some of those studios are running into issues they shouldn't, and wouldn't if there was a better fit watching over them and guiding them IMO.

That is the problem. The hands off approach is not working. MS/XBOX is letting their studios on their own, to do whatever they want to do. This creates problems such as 343i not giving a crap about halo, Rare not touching their IPs, and Mojang not focusing on xbox platform like it supposed to do.

Yeah I still don't understand why they're doing Perfect Dark without Rare. It's not like when Nintendo, say, did F-Zero with Sega; Sega had teams well used to making arcade racing games including a few in the style of a F-Zero. When they announced The Initiative partnering up with Crystal Dynamics for PD, my first thought was "but CD don't really have any experience with first-person games or FPS games, how's that work?".

The whole thing with the Minecraft update is just...kind of depressing? Like, I get if it's a mistake, but then also saying basically that no, don't expect RT in Minecraft for Series X any time in the future, when that was one of the first games used to demo RT capabilities of Series X, that's just all around baffling. It probably feels like a slap in the face for some fans.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Yup, all true but there's nothing to stop them from turning this around.

 

[CuNi]

Yup, all true but there's nothing to stop them from turning this around.

Nothing but themselves

 

[Leyasu]

I played a couple of matches yesterday afternoon when I had 20 minutes to spare.

The first game dumped me into a North American server where everyone was playing like a million dollars was on the line (Quick play to boot) and the latency and desync was of the charts. The second lol, a quick play Oddball in the EU (thankfully) where the players were so bad or so new to the game, the ODST level bot was top of the scoreboard on their team lol. No bullshit. New players shouldn't be getting put into matches like this. Things like that only hurt the ability of retaining new players

 

[Jibran#one]

They have treyarch now , I'd software now Infinity ward I swear to God halo under 343 is blasphemy , the game should have atleast 4 5 maps now with coop and.lForge to keep the fans happy but 0 content is just mindboggling at this point

 

[Panajev2001a]

The problem with this "live service" is that 343i thinks that finishing missing content is the same as adding new content.

"We're adding a brand new mode - King of the Hill!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new playlist - Slayer!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new feature - Campaign co-op!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.

Their "live service" is just... finishing the game. Forge, Firefight, Customs, Playlists; all of this is missing content, but they're pretending that releasing it piece meal constitutes a live service worth paying for. No one missing feature is enough to rejuvenate this dead game on its own, but they're stuck pretending that it is. Which means Halo Infinite still has years of work ahead of it before it'll be where it should've launched at... and no one will come back to play a cross-gen F2P shooter limping on outdated tech two years from now when we're knee deep in next-gen only games that make Halo Infinite look even more embarrassing. If we thought Halo 5 was the low point, I suspect we've still got new lows to enjoy thanks to this disaster of a game.

They jumped the shark and were not ready to support it smoothly, but if you are a smart GaaS publisher you stop putting so much content in the initial 1.0 product and defer development of content based on how people play and how the market is responding overall.

They executed badly a strategy that is the ideal one for all GaaS publishers. The basic giant game with tons of content added on top after launch is just a stopgap there some smarter publishers are using to get people accustomed to it IMHO.

 

[Panajev2001a]

They have treyarch now , I'd software now Infinity ward I swear to God halo under 343 is blasphemy , the game should have atleast 4 5 maps now with coop and.lForge to keep the fans happy but 0 content is just mindboggling at this point

You will find a studio culture with some idealistic business unaware leads and main devs will be so wonderfully bad at execution in an almost incredible way.
Maybe it is not their case, but it could explain it.

 

[jigglet]

MS at this point, should fire 343i leaders. They are incapable of utilizing MS biggest mascot, and ruining to the ground.

Yeah but you're looking at the game. You need to focus on the team and whether they feel inclusive. Fuck the game, it's irrelevant. Are developers' feelings being pandered to? The important questions, please.

 

[IDKFA]

Didn't they want this game to last ten years?

 

[Topher]

Are the complaints primarily about multiplayer? I was hoping for more content added to the campaign myself. If this is how "live service" games are supposed to work then I'm not a fan.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Didn't they want this game to last ten years?

They do, they are just going to stretch one games content over a ten year drip feed.

 

[STARSBarry]

They do, they are just going to stretch one games content over a ten year drip feed.

Can't wait for the games 5th anniversary where they add the "brand new" game mode Infection.

 

[Majima Everywhere System]

Didn't they want this game to last ten years?

This just sounds like a threat now.

 

[Three]

The problem with this "live service" is that 343i thinks that finishing missing content is the same as adding new content.

"We're adding a brand new mode - King of the Hill!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new playlist - Slayer!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.
"We're adding a brand new feature - Campaign co-op!" That's been in every Halo game previously and should have been included at launch.

Their "live service" is just... finishing the game. Forge, Firefight, Customs, Playlists; all of this is missing content, but they're pretending that releasing it piece meal constitutes a live service worth paying for. No one missing feature is enough to rejuvenate this dead game on its own, but they're stuck pretending that it is. Which means Halo Infinite still has years of work ahead of it before it'll be where it should've launched at... and no one will come back to play a cross-gen F2P shooter limping on outdated tech two years from now when we're knee deep in next-gen only games that make Halo Infinite look even more embarrassing. If we thought Halo 5 was the low point, I suspect we've still got new lows to enjoy thanks to this disaster of a game.

In a GaaS model it is important that something is happening than it all happening at once because you want people to look forward to something and pay the rest of the months/seasons subscriptions.

What should have gave it away for you and was so blatantly obvious, which I tried to warn people about years ago, was how they handled MCCs release on PC. They essentially spread out the release of an already developed game over a year.

Master Chief Collection's PC Release Schedule Is A Mistake

Microsoft is trickling out the Halo games in chronological order to PC and it's a headache for PC players.

www.thegamer.com

I don't need to tell you why I hope.

 

[GymWolf]

I remember when people got mad when i joked about infinite being a gaas.

Good times.

 

[Jibran#one]

Cod is gaas with new content every month with maps modes and what not
Battlefield and halo are not gaas they are without content unfinished games ffs

 

[oldergamer]

Cod is gaas with new content every month with maps modes and what not
Battlefield and halo are not gaas they are without content unfinished games ffs

That's really dumb dude. Halo could be considered Gaas since Halo 2 or 3. This argument about it being unfinished is only a thing because we knew what was originally planned. if we didn't know, the confirmation bias wouldn't be so prevalent.

 

[FireFly]

In a GaaS model it is important that something is happening than it all happening at once because you want people to look forward to something and pay the rest of the months/seasons subscriptions.

What should have gave it away for you and was so blatantly obvious, which I tried to warn people about years ago, was how they handled MCCs release on PC. They essentially spread out the release of an already developed game over a year.

Master Chief Collection's PC Release Schedule Is A Mistake

Microsoft is trickling out the Halo games in chronological order to PC and it's a headache for PC players.

www.thegamer.com

I don't need to tell you why I hope.

Currently they are updating the game more slowly than a standard "boxed" product and far more slowly than Halo 5 was updated.

If content is "already developed" for Infinite, it makes zero sense to trickle it out at such a glacial pace that the whole community dies.

 

[Banjo64]

That's really dumb dude. Halo could be considered Gaas since Halo 2 or 3. This argument about it being unfinished is only a thing because we knew what was originally planned. if we didn't know, the confirmation bias wouldn't be so prevalent.

Well not really.

I class it as unfinished because it has launched without series staples such as forge, the custom game browser introduced with MCC, Firefight from Reach and 5, game modes like capture the flag/duos/griffball/shotty snipes/infection.

 

[Three]

Currently they are updating the game more slowly than a standard "boxed" product and far more slowly than Halo 5 was updated.

If content is "already developed" for Infinite, it makes zero sense to trickle it out at such a glacial pace that the whole community dies.

I have no idea if the content for Infinite is already developed or not but I suspect their "10 yr plan" is why they have spread it so thin for content. The already developed I was referring to was for MCC. It doesn't take 5 yrs to port an xbox one remaster to PC. It was obvious why they were trickling it out like that for the GP subs.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

Microsoft is not capable of managing creatives.

 

[Hari Seldon]

I have a hard time being mad at a game that is $0. There is no reason at all for me to spend more because why would I give a fuck how my master chief looks in an online FPS? They made a gaas game, but forgot to include the part where the users have something to spend money on lmao.

I feel like if I actually paid for this game I should get mad at the lack of updates and the limited maps. If they don't update it I will just play something else, remembering the time that I did play fondly, and still will not have spent any money on this.

 

[R3claimer117]

Jesus Christ some of you and the constant halo nonsense the franchise isn’t going no where. Has 343 been mismanaged to certain degree yes but there will be more content in the future. I don’t get the need for the instant content drop people feel they need like go play something else when it comes it comes. Everyone that likes halo wishes for more content but people also don’t want rush content or minuscule updates either.

 

[R3claimer117]

Microsoft is not capable of managing creatives.

lol yeah all the other companies are really good at it! Right this stupid bullshit.

 

[sircaw]

the multiplayer is fun, there just isn't enough maps or reason to keep playing, sadly

343 stinks

is there no mod support for this game, i recall people being able to make their own maps in doom for example.

That would surely help the game.

 

[FireFly]

I have no idea if the content for Infinite is already developed or not but I suspect their "10 yr plan" is why they have spread it so thin for content. The already developed I was referring to was for MCC. It doesn't take 5 yrs to port an xbox one remaster to PC. It was obvious why they were trickling it out like that for the GP subs.

It would be strange for a 10 year plan for building the player base to be designed both to give gamers less content than they've ever had *and* to update the game more slowly than perhaps any previous Halo titles. If you're comparing to MCC on PC, within 7 months they had the first 4 games out. So I think the evidence points to serious development issues rather any plan to update the game this slowly.

(Perhaps the staggered release of MCC PC was a marketing decision, but you also have to consider that they were effectively releasing/porting 12 different engines, and the original "big bang" release ended in complete disaster. So it also made sense to go slow).

 

[kingfey]

Yeah I still don't understand why they're doing Perfect Dark without Rare. It's not like when Nintendo, say, did F-Zero with Sega; Sega had teams well used to making arcade racing games including a few in the style of a F-Zero. When they announced The Initiative partnering up with Crystal Dynamics for PD, my first thought was "but CD don't really have any experience with first-person games or FPS games, how's that work?".

Rare seems to be very allergic to their Ips. They can work on any of these ips. Yet they try to make something like Everwild.

 

[Three]

It would be strange for a 10 year plan for building the player base to be designed both to give gamers less content than they've ever had *and* to update the game more slowly than perhaps any previous Halo titles. If you're comparing to MCC on PC, within 7 months they had the first 4 games out. So I think the evidence points to serious development issues rather any plan to update the game this slowly.

(Perhaps the staggered release of MCC PC was a marketing decision, but you also have to consider that they were effectively releasing/porting 12 different engines, and the original "big bang" release ended in complete disaster. So it also made sense to go slow).

They were porting a 5yr old xbox one game though. Nothing to do with the engines. It's not 12 different engines, some of which had PC releases anyway. It's one xbox one game.

First 4 games staggered across 7 months. What stopped them from releasing all of them on the 7th month all at once then? Strategy. Their GaaS subscription plan.

I mean you can't honestly believe they were struggling with already remastered engines for 5 years and they miraculously completed in chronological order within those 7 months.